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PELIKAN took my Binderized M200 away! o_O


Edgar Allan Bo

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I am not worried that I will not get my pen back - they must send it back to the customs office because it IS an original M200 - it's just plain STUPID that I have to wait soo long in such a silly case where it's soo obvious that there is nothing at all wrong with the pen!!! :gaah:

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I have just left a voicemail message for my Pelikan representative, asking him to contact me about this issue.

It would be good if some real facts could be used to contain the rumour & speculation so far in much of this thread.

 

We'd appreciate it if you could let all of us know when you get something concrete, Richard.

 

Regards,

 

Richard.

 

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Good luck with this. At least you have Mr. Binder contacting Pelikan. Hopefully the rep can vouch for the pen and all will be fine.

Anton Emdin

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I would do three things, one get aquainted with German and EU regulations in regards to suspected counterfieit merchandise and personal importation of consumer merchandise for personal use.

 

Two, contact Pelikan and talk with their PR Director, state you purchased the pen from an authorised dealer in the United States who customised the nib of said pen to your taste. I would scan all paperwork from Richard Binder so they can be emailed to to Pelikan.

 

If there is no arrangement with Pelikan and German Customs, I would get that in writing and contact the supervisor of the customs officer who gave you grief over the pen, if you don't get the answer you want, go higher, notify your member of parlament if neccessary.

"Life moves pretty fast, if you do not stop and look around once and a while you might just miss it."

Ferris Bueller

 

 

 

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The argument over whether the details of the USDA's program are adequate is a very old one by now. It was hashed over at considerable length by people who knew what they were talking about. They still disagree with each other. It doesn't seem likely that anything beyond allegations of conspiracy between government and big agribusiness would come from continuing here.

Although I am very reticent to continue an irrelevant subthread on cattle inspections in this very relevant thread on customs inspections, I feel compelled to reply briefly because spongiform encephalopathies like Mad Cow have been a focus of my interest and reading for many years. Possum Hill, you should not be so dismissive of arguments that American industry does not test enough. Spongiform encephalopathies cross species regularly; there are multiple uncontested cases of its appearance across the nation in one species or another; there have been multiple uncontested cases of its appearance in the US and Canada in animals that are part of the food chain; and, most important, there are multiple uncontested cases of producers' noncompliance with the regulations that are designed to minimize the incidence of the disease. And as for disputes among those who know, the regulations that were passed a decade ago were considered by critics to be far too weak and have recently been strengthened by government in some degree, so just because a regulation is passed does not mean that it is best. One example is the USDA's preventing--yes, preventing--American beef producers from voluntarily testing each animal in their herds, which would not only bring the testing to the par observed by some other countries but would also increase exports to countries like Japan.

 

JN

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It's not just me, everyone (in Germany) who buys a (new) Pelikan pen somewhere else (Malaysia, USA, HK, etc.) will face the same treatment and will have his pen sent to PELIKAN first... and this wasn't the case earlier... I had a Binder-Pelikan waiting for me at the customs office last year (2008) and there was no problem at all, seems it was not long ago that PELIKAN started with this procedure...

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Wow, this is nuts. What about vintage Pelikans coming in to collectors.

JELL-O, IT'S WHATS FOR DINNER!

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People stop it with the beef inspections! It has nothing to do with this issue! :angry:

 

 

Sk2yshine,

 

I'm terribly sorry about your pen. My first thought was to have people boycott Pelikan until you get your pen back. Since I've calmed down, I'm hoping Richard Binder can work it out for you. I import pens to the U.S. from Asia all the time, and I'd of course hate them to be declared fakes and confiscated.

 

Good luck to you.

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People stop it with the beef inspections! It has nothing to do with this issue! :angry:

 

 

Sk2yshine,

 

I'm terribly sorry about your pen. My first thought was to have people boycott Pelikan until you get your pen back. Since I've calmed down, I'm hoping Richard Binder can work it out for you. I import pens to the U.S. from Asia all the time, and I'd of course hate them to be declared fakes and confiscated.

 

Good luck to you.

I'll join in on the boycott if you want to push forward with it. :W2FPN: (Note to self, Take Welcome to Foutain Pen Network of the sign and put "Boycott Pelikan!")

Aurora Optima Burgundy Celluloid

MontBlanc 149

MontBlanc Starwalker Cool Blue

MontBlanc 144

Lamy 2000

and about 30 other pens

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People stop it with the beef inspections! It has nothing to do with this issue! :angry:

 

 

Sk2yshine,

 

I'm terribly sorry about your pen. My first thought was to have people boycott Pelikan until you get your pen back. Since I've calmed down, I'm hoping Richard Binder can work it out for you. I import pens to the U.S. from Asia all the time, and I'd of course hate them to be declared fakes and confiscated.

 

Good luck to you.

I'll join in on the boycott if you want to push forward with it. :W2FPN: (Note to self, Take Welcome to Foutain Pen Network of the sign and put "Boycott Pelikan!")

 

 

Uhh.... That would be up to Sk2yshine. It's his pen.

 

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Major kudos to Mr. Binder for stepping in to offer his assistance. The problem was not of his doing, but it affects his customer. Service after the sale, a rarity these days. My hat's off to you sir.

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The argument over whether the details of the USDA's program are adequate is a very old one by now. It was hashed over at considerable length by people who knew what they were talking about. They still disagree with each other. It doesn't seem likely that anything beyond allegations of conspiracy between government and big agribusiness would come from continuing here.

Although I am very reticent to continue an irrelevant subthread on cattle inspections in this very relevant thread on customs inspections, I feel compelled to reply briefly because spongiform encephalopathies like Mad Cow have been a focus of my interest and reading for many years. Possum Hill, you should not be so dismissive of arguments that American industry does not test enough. Spongiform encephalopathies cross species regularly; there are multiple uncontested cases of its appearance across the nation in one species or another; there have been multiple uncontested cases of its appearance in the US and Canada in animals that are part of the food chain; and, most important, there are multiple uncontested cases of producers' noncompliance with the regulations that are designed to minimize the incidence of the disease. And as for disputes among those who know, the regulations that were passed a decade ago were considered by critics to be far too weak and have recently been strengthened by government in some degree, so just because a regulation is passed does not mean that it is best. One example is the USDA's preventing--yes, preventing--American beef producers from voluntarily testing each animal in their herds, which would not only bring the testing to the par observed by some other countries but would also increase exports to countries like Japan.

In a thread about a Pelikan pen being held up or seized at customs, I feel I am justified in being dismissive of all sides of an argument about USDA inspection of meat and animals, regardless of how interesting it is.

 

It doesn't belong here.

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Sad to say German customs are the most proactive in the world. There have been a number of high profile cases recently where they have literally stormed conferences and exhibitions and pulled equipment off of stands. They don't actually need anything more than a suspicion to do this and there have also been some very embarrassing climb downs when it has been found out that the 'tip offs' have come from competitors.

 

It's a crazy situation but the German customs are actually acting completely within their rights. They will have been given a blanket request from Pelikan and that is all they need. It is unfortunate that the particular customs official seems so officious.

 

Your only option really is to be patent. Any complaining will probably result in a closing of ranks and an extension of the time taken.

Edited by paulrbarnard
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And the German police have been, with the encouragement of certain fanatical archaeologists who don't seem to realize that you can't plow a field between Samarra & York without turning up a Roman or Greek coin, seizing people's collections of ancient coins on the grounds that, without an official pedigree & certification, they must have been looted from archaeological sites! This madness is particularly astonishing when one realizes that there are plenty of ancient coins in Europe which have never been buried at all — a study of countermarked Spanish coppers reveals that there were Roman bronze coins in circulation up into the XVII century.

 

So, no, I'm not surprised at all, & it makes me very reluctant to have any dealings with Germany, which is a pity.

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While waiting for your pen to return you might peruse this document: http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUri...003R1383:DE:NOT

 

Found it on www.zoll.de under Verbote und Beschraenkungen, Verordnung (EG) Nr. 1891 / 2004 der Kommission vom 21. Oktober 2004 mit Durchfuehrungsvorschriften zu der Verordnung (E) Nr. 1383/2003 des Rates ueber das Vorgehen der Zollbehoerden gegen Waren, die im Verdacht stehen, bestimmte Rechte geistigen Eigentums zu verletzen, und die Massnahmen gegenueber Waren, die erkanntermassen derartige Rechte verletzen.

 

Makes fascinating reading.

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Two thoughts:

 

1. Since when does a private company act in the manner, and with the legal authority, of a government agency?

 

2. I've recently been considering buying some more pens and, naturally, Pelikan was on the list of brands under consideration. Alas, no longer.

 

German Customs and Pelikan both seem to be run by the sort of German people so ruthlessly lampooned for decades by British and American comedians. Are they not aware of the image problems this sort of behaviour creates in the age of the internet? Good luck sorting out this ludicrous mess.

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Are they not aware of the image problems this sort of behaviour creates in the age of the internet?

 

What image do you mean? The one of the diligent company trying to protecting itself and its customers from the threat of counterfeit?

 

I'm sure if the word "Pelikan" was replaced with "Montblanc" then none of this discussion would be taking place...

 

To the OP: I hope your pen is returned to you soon. It must be very frustrating but I hope you can understand why German customs is doing this.

 

Martin

The Writing Desk

Fountain Pen Specialists since 2000

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I know that MBs are regularly faked but is it the same with Pelikan? Should a potential buyer beware of 'bargain' Pelikans also?

 

 

 

<i>Den.

</i>

"The universe is a big place, perhaps the biggest". - Kurt Vonnegut.

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QUOTE (Frits B @ Jun 17 2009, 07:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I was slightly baffled when the woman told me that the pen is now going to PELIKAN AND is maybe never coming back again... for whatever reasons!

 

But there is nothing wrong with the pen... sure, the nib is customized, but that's not Pelikan's problem, the pen isn't fake because of that!

 

IF the reason is that they fear that some Pelikan pens might be fake - they cannot check EVERY pen, if EVERY Pelikan pen from abroad has to be sent to them first to be checked - then it will take them soo much time to go through all these pens and to check every case... that is very inefficient! :huh:

You are too reasonable about this. What happens here is theft. Pelikan is not the owner of its pens once they have been sold, and what you do with it is your prerogative. If I buy trousers that are too long (happens all the time) I have them shortened. In addition, Pelikan is a private company which is not in a position to instruct a customs officer to confiscate your pen, to the same extent that they cannot tell the police to search your house for fakes. You should claim immediate return of the pen to its lawful owner = you, and lodge a complaint with the customs officer's superiors.

 

You understand that you just accused the German Customs of being an accesory to theft by Pelikan? Without sounding like a jerk (and I will), you had better have a German law degree and be registered to practice law in Germany and have court cases to back you up. Otherwise you are doing everyone a disservice by clearly saying that without a doubt it is theft and that they have all rights to it. At best you are giving advice with no backing, and at worst you are just plain propogating misinformation.

 

You also understand that Pelikan has a right to it's trademark, and that they are allowed to actively stop the propogation of items bearing fake trademarks? At leat, from my understanding (I am not a lawyer).

 

-Nkk

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What image do you mean? The one of the diligent company trying to protecting itself and its customers from the threat of counterfeit?

 

I'm sure if the word "Pelikan" was replaced with "Montblanc" then none of this discussion would be taking place...

 

To the OP: I hope your pen is returned to you soon. It must be very frustrating but I hope you can understand why German customs is doing this.

 

Martin

Well, absolutely not on all three points, actually.

First, no, this is not the action of a diligent company, this is abuse of power by some nut in a lazy company's legal department. Pelikan could not possibly make a case before a judge that they are being materially harmed by fake M200s mailed to individuals by authorized dealers in the USA. They are simply abusing a poorly-conceived law.

Second, no, if MB does not do this I'm sure it is only because they are aware that it would do even further catastrphic damage to their tattered reputation.

Third, absolutely no. "Understanding" and accepting a bad law is both dangerous and immoral in a free society. That's how societies cease to be free.

ron

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