Modern Parker 51???

[Nihontochicken]

Given the widespread admiration of the Parker 51 and the lack of a current model faithful to the design and quality of the original, what is your take on the following?

 

1. If a 51 replica faithful to the original Aero in design and quality were currently manufactured in the USA (not necessarily by Parker), what would you consider to be the maximum fair and reasonable retail sales price?

 

2. If a remake were reasonably faithful to the original, but its parts generally NOT interchangeable with the original pens, would this seriously dissuade your interest?

 

3. What features and options in the original models would you most like to see included in the remake?

 

4. What improvements would you like to see in the remake (design, materials, whatever)?

....................................................

 

FWIW, my responses.

 

1. $70.

 

2. Somewhat but not a lot. I would differentiate between collectible vintage pens and modern users.

 

3. Empire caps, blue diamond gold clips (but longer), Kryptonite (aka "pli-glass") sacs, and most of all, Flighters!!!

 

4. Stainless steel section with integral threaded ring to replace the separate clutch ring and afford a threaded cap, metal shells for Flighters, a more positive manner of aligning the nib to the shell, o-rings or other design to obviate the need for shellac or other sticky/gooey sealants.

 

Any other takers?

[JimStrutton]

My friend Ralph Prather does make a reasonable pass at a version of a "51" Vac and his parts are interchangeable, but I think the biggest flaw here is the cost issue. The pen excluding the cap costs around the $350 mark. So that blows your $70 right out of the water. For an all metal pen, then $1,000 is more like it including cap.

 

I think that Hero do a reasonable job of a clone, so unless you made a true collectors item then would there be any takers?

 

The 51SE still seems to command a premium price, more that it is worth IMHO, so that gives a clue and as has been said before, that is just a 45 in fancy clothes.

 

Can't see it me

 

Jim

[p51collector]

I read somewhere that the original price of the 51 in 1942 was about $14 which equates to about $145 or so in todays money.... I think that would be reasonable for a new 51 of equal quality.

 

I'd like to see various colors and designs and cap selections myself. Maybe even a clear hood and some kind of design on the nib?

[twdpens]

I read somewhere that the original price of the 51 in 1942 was about $14 which equates to about $145 or so in todays money....  I think that would be reasonable for a new 51 of equal quality.

What you didn't mention is that the original Parker 51 was manufactured in huge quantities by a Western nation that still had an manufacturing-based economy. To achieve that price today something would have to give - most probably country of origin.

 

The 51SE ....that is just a 45 in fancy clothes.

 

But isn't this true of most pens made today? For example, you can buy an "upgraded" Pelikan M200/M250 sporting the nib from the M400 for about two-thirds of the price of a "proper" M400. Does the lower-cost pen have inferior performance? No. Nothing wrong with either product, BTW, just aimed at a slightly different customer.

 

Just a couple of thoughts...

 

Martin

[Johnson]

I read somewhere that the original price of the 51 in 1942 was about $14 which equates to about $145 or so in todays money.... I think that would be reasonable for a new 51 of equal quality.

My first instinct upon reading the OP was $60, but reading a few of these posts I realize that is unrealistic. Taking into account not only the value of today's dollar, but also the fact that this was a pen which was mass manufactured for general use, and today would be made for a niche market.

 

I'm also an admirer of the Hero 100. I own two of them, and both are fantastic writers and, IMO, attractive to boot, with just enough differentiation from a traditional P51 Aero to make them their own, unlike other Hero's which try to be direct copies of popular pens, which I do not like. The biggest bummer regarding the Hero 100 is one nib size. I love the F nib on them, which writes more like an XF, and I don't even like XF nibs in general. But it'd still be nice to have some nib choices.

[JimStrutton]

The 51SE ....that is just a 45 in fancy clothes.

 

But isn't this true of most pens made today? For example, you can buy an "upgraded" Pelikan M200/M250 sporting the nib from the M400 for about two-thirds of the price of a "proper" M400. Does the lower-cost pen have inferior performance? No. Nothing wrong with either product, BTW, just aimed at a slightly different customer.

 

Just a couple of thoughts...

 

Martin

OK Martin I see where you are coming from, But! (Ain't there always a BUT )

 

What you quote about the Pelikan is true, but the 51SE was a total different kettle of fish. The 45 was/is an excellent pen, but in no way is it a "51", therefore the 51SE is in no way a "51", it is a very nice 45. I tried one in a shop in Bristol a year or so back and liked it but not enough to buy it, unfortunately I had a "51" in my pocket and was able to directly compare, I even let the shop manager try the "51" and he was surprised. (By the way, how can you manage a fountain pen franchise in a big department store and never have ever written with a "51"?)

 

I think the Hero is a closer match, but they could do with a wider nib choice, the Hero 100 with a factory stub, now there is a thought.

 

Jim

[psfred]

A Hero made with Lexan would be perfect.

 

Give that the vast majority of modern pens seem to be "signature only" pens, a wider nib choice would be needed, but that's not a big deal compared to setting up make them at all!

 

Peter

[kissing]

I tried one in a shop in Bristol a year or so back and liked it but not enough to buy it, unfortunately I had a "51" in my pocket and was able to directly compare

How unfortunate

 

:ltcapd: :roflmho: :bunny1:

 

http://www.Parker.51SE.justgotowned.com/

Edited January 6, 2007 by kissing

[George]

:roflmho: :roflmho: :roflmho: :roflmho:

 

 

http://www.Parker.51SE.justgotowned.com/

 

 

LOL

 

:roflmho: :roflmho: :roflmho:

[Richard]

1. If a 51 replica faithful to the original Aero in design and quality were currently manufactured in the USA (not necessarily by Parker), what would you consider to be the maximum fair and reasonable retail sales price?

$175.00.

 

2. If a remake were reasonably faithful to the original, but its parts generally NOT interchangeable with the original pens, would this seriously dissuade your interest?

I would categorically not be interested.

 

3. What features and options in the original models would you most like to see included in the remake?

Blue Diamond clip, DJ, Vacumatic filling, choice of stainless steel or sterling or GF or solid gold cap.

 

4. What improvements would you like to see in the remake (design, materials, whatever)?

None. Period.

[Nihontochicken]

QUOTE

1. If a 51 replica faithful to the original Aero in design and quality were currently manufactured in the USA (not necessarily by Parker), what would you consider to be the maximum fair and reasonable retail sales price?

 

$175.00.

 

QUOTE

2. If a remake were reasonably faithful to the original, but its parts generally NOT interchangeable with the original pens, would this seriously dissuade your interest?

 

I would categorically not be interested.

 

QUOTE

3. What features and options in the original models would you most like to see included in the remake?

 

Blue Diamond clip, DJ, Vacumatic filling, choice of stainless steel or sterling or GF or solid gold cap.

 

QUOTE

4. What improvements would you like to see in the remake (design, materials, whatever)?

 

None. Period.

 

Richard, please reconsider, and don't be so wishy-washy. Let us know what you really think!!! :roflmho: :roflmho: :roflmho:

Edited January 6, 2007 by Nihontochicken

[Dillo]

Hi,

 

I'm mostly with Richard here except for one thing, the filler mechanism. I would be thinking of a floating piston-filler which replaces the diaphragm in "51" with a reciprocating plunger that has two Viton gaskets on the piston head with silicone grease contained between them. That way, the filler would not only be, in a sense, easier to repair (With the same tools at the vacumatic! Save the pellet pusher and all that stuff.), it would last longer, work the same way, and hold the same amount of ink as the vacumatic would. In fact, it might be possible to fit standard "51" pens with a similar mechanism.

 

Yes, $175 is more reasonable. But remember, all of you, mass production is not an easy thing, and the tooling costs incredible amounts of money.

 

Dillon

[BillTheEditor]

I really liked the '52 Studebaker that I once owned. Great design, ahead of its time in so many ways, comfortable and reliable. If I had the time and money to fool around with restoration, or the cash to buy one that someone else had already restored, I'd buy another one in a heartbeat. But do I want a 2007 version of the '52 Studebaker? No. What would be the point? Is any modern auto company going to be interested in building such a car? No. Why would they be?

 

You know what? I am not interested in a "modern Parker '51'" either. The original is good enough, available enough, and cheap enough that, in my opinion, there is no need for any pen company to go there again. In addition, how likely is it that any modern pen company could produce a pen of equal or better quality (speaking of design and materials) for a low price? And how likely is it that any modern pen company would want to risk the inevitable and endless nit-picking comparisons to the original (or the potential lawsuits from the current owners of Parker)?

 

If you want a "modern Parker '51'," buy a Hero 100. If you want a quality pen at a reasonable price, with interesting features, classic design, and proven record, the world is full of them. Start with a Lamy 2000 or a Sailor 1911, for example. Some things are best enjoyed for the originals that they were, in my opinion.

Edited March 18, 2007 by BillTheEditor