Penman inks: Are they safe?

[gyv]

Would you fill your most cherished pens with a Penman ink?

[Jimmy James]

My most cherished pen is a Parker Frontier. Yeah, I'd fill it with Penman. In fact, I have done so before.

 

I wouldn't put it in my Parker 21, though.

 

I'd think you're fine in a modern pen without transparent/translucent parts.

[fpfanatic5]

I wouldn't buy Penman ink in the first place because of its price (I think most people know, but just in case it has been discontinued). From what I have heard, it is known to clog pens, but I would think that it would not do anything to damage a pen. I'm not an expert, but I would assume that a good flush would clear it out. If you like the ink, I don't see anything to lose.

[PAKMAN]

I used it continuously in a Pelikan 400 for several years, have used it in Parker Vacumatics and Sheaffer snorkels. If you let is sit up in a pen and dry out it takes a while to get it good and flushed out but that is true of any ink. Yes like all of our vintage pens, Penman ink is no longer produced but is still available in NOS from various locations. If you like Ruby, Mocha or Emerald you can get a bottle for around $15 probably between $20-25 for Sapphire. But Sapphire is the standard that all other blues seem to be measured against! I bought out several folks of their Sapphire and have about 10 bottles, so it should last me a number of years! The prices are not that bad when Sailor is $12, Diamine $12, Noodlers $12-16, Visconti $15 and Caran d'Ache is $17. But each person has to make their own decision. We have Noodlers creep, PR SITB, MB pH and Iron Gall, and Penman Saturation. But if we steer away from every ink that someone had a problem with at one time or another we would soon run out of options! I guess I should tell people to stay away from it so the price would drop some or so that there would be more available if I ever run out! Anyway, with reasonable flushing and pen care most any modern ink will do fine in most pens.

[Doug Add]

I have filled my most cherished pens with Penman, and never had the first problem. I have been using it continuously for ten years in a wide variety of pens. That said, I would never pay what is being asked for it today (the most I ever paid for a bottle of Penman was $7.50) when there are other inks that have similar saturation properties.

[kissing]

If it is any help at all, here is some information I found on Penman inks on Richard Binder's website:

 

When capitalized (Penman™), Parker’s trademarked name for its line of highly saturated premium inks made by Documentel in Germany and introduced in 1993. Penman inks were notorious for staining and clogging, and Parker withdrew the line in 2001.

[Chris]

The Penman story is still going strong. My belief is that the intensity of the Penman colours came from highly saturated inks. In a generation used to wishy-washy writing fluds, this led to problems. But today, we know about saturated inks, avoiding letting pens dry out and rinsing every now and then. with such simple precautions, my Cross pens have survived Penman Sapphire for over ten years and still work as well as ever - which is pretty good.

 

Chris

 

ps - no, you are right. Penman is rubbish, let the prices fall and send your stocks to me!

[OldGriz]

OK, as a die hard lover of things Parker, here is my take...

 

YES they are safe.... NO they are not for every pen..... YES, you need to watch out after filling a pen with it.... NO it is not going make your pen disintegrate or the feed fall out or the nib melt.... YES, it may very well clog a pen you put it in.... NO, they are not prohibitively expensive and rare. In fact you are seeing more and more Penman ink around, especially from a seller in Greece....

 

OK, have I completely confused you. Sorry, not what I intended.

Richard Binder and I had an interesting conversation about Penman ink when I got some of it... I have Ruby, Sapphire, Ebony and Emerald.

Richard said he would never again use the ink as he found it clogs most pens after a short time. He especially told me to never try it in any of my 51s as it would clog up the collectors.

Now, I am one to generally take any advise given by Richard in the way of pens and inks as close to being the same as the Tablets coming down from the Mount. However, I am also a thick headed Irishman who has to prove things for himself and I really liked the Sapphire and Emerald ink colors.... SOOOOOOO, I picked my two wetest writing 51 Vac and filled each one with a different color...

They wrote beautifully............................................ for about 24 hours and suddenly started to skip and write very dry...

I took them apart and the collectors were full of ink, but kind of dry.... so I emptied the pens, UC cleaned the collectors and nibs and filled them with their old standby inks.

I next decided to see how the ink performed in my Vacumatic... I figured a totally different feed and nib configuration might be the answer... in MY case it worked like a dream. My Vacs tend to write on the wet side and the Penman ink worked perfectly in them and did not dry out or cause problems...

But such was not the case in some other pens I tried... no luck in Triumph nibbed Snorkels, i.e.

 

So to cut to the quick, Penman is not the horrible ink that a lot of people say it is.... IT IS a troublesome ink in more pens than not and only you can decide by trial and error what pens it is suitable for in your collection.

For me I only use it in my Vacumatics and Pelikans... for some reason neither of these has had any problem with Penman ink...

I won't even wave the bottle over any of my 51s... not worth the effort...

[KCat]

OK, as a die hard lover of things Parker, here is my take...

 

YES they are safe.... NO they are not for every pen..... YES, you need to watch out after filling a pen with it.... NO it is not going make your pen disintegrate or the feed fall out or the nib melt.... YES, it may very well clog a pen you put it in.... NO, they are not prohibitively expensive and rare. In fact you are seeing more and more Penman ink around, especially from a seller in Greece....

 

is he back? on ebay? Gotta get over there!

 

Been using Penman Emerald for several years now in my Pelikans and in a couple of other pens. No problems at all. In fact, this is one of those inks like Diamine that never fail to start up even after sitting for a while. One of my Pels has lived on a steady diet of Emerald - no ink changes just the occasional flush - for at least 4 years now. I've lost track of when I discovered this ink (thanks to viv!)

 

I've preached on the topic before and agree that the problem is largely with people not treating highly saturated inks with a little more care than "wimpy" inks. I've had more trouble with glogging from two "new" brands than with any Penman ink.

 

[twdpens]

One important thing to remember is that Parker is not a specialist writing equipment brand and that Penman ink was on sale in a variety of different stationery outlets, mostly staffed by people who knew very little about fountain pen care. Therefore, it is not difficult to imagine fountain pen owners buying this ink to use on those odd occasions only to find that in between uses their pen has become clogged. Parker doesn't really want lots of warranty issues connected with a product that contributes very little to their turnover so Penman is withdrawn. Parker had Quink anyway and sister company Waterman produces ink as well.

 

Contrast that situation with pen use and care by those that contribute to this board. If any of us experienced such an issue we would either try a different pen or just put it down to experience, knowing that some pen/ink combinations don't work as well as others.

 

BTW, I have an unopened bottle of Penman that I bought in an office supplies shop several years ago. I think that had about half a dozen left so I bought the lot. One went to a former colleague, I sold a couple at a WES meeting and the remainder was advertised on the Zoss list and ended up in the USA!

 

Martin

[andyk]

I only have one bottle of Sapphire that I use from time to time, to date only used it in my modern Duofolds with no problems. I wouldn't use it in something like a Vac or a Pelikan where clarity might be an issue.

 

Andy