Waterman 512 Psf 14K Overlay

[Guest Ray Cornett]

I have made posts about this pen before mainly for repair information. In the research I have done for the pen I have not found a definite date. I find dates of between 1908 and the late 1920s. I never got a reply from Waterman when I emailed them about it.

Might anyone have definite documentation on this pen which can be seen in the link below? This is not my pen but a better picture of the pen in question. Mine is apart right now for sac replacement.

 

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~him/Wat14K/Wat14k_3.jpg

[Xof72000]

"512 PSF" ... : is that what you have on the bottom end of the pen ? If not, where did you get this number from ?

 

This seems important to me, as you know the Waterman numbering system has changed in 1917.... and yours could also be a "552".

 

I've got a 1919 Waterman catalog where "552 1/2" and "554" solid gold models are showned (were sold $27.00 and $37.00 at the time ...)

[Guest Ray Cornett]

Under a 30x and 60x loupe it looks to be 512 but the number is fairly worn as is the lettering underneath at the "6 o'clock" area. I will look again.

 

edit - Upon looking again it does indeed seem to be 512. The first and third number, a 5 and 2, are fairly obvious. Have to look really hard for the impression of the top half of the 1 inbetween them. The I only say it is a 1 because of the serif at the bottom of the number and what appears to be a stright line upwards instead of going in the direction the top half of the 2 would go. And it does not curve at the bottom like a 5. Also, originally when I looked at the pen when I received it and started posting about it I thought the mark at dead center between the number and PSF at the bottom is indeed a 1/2 which I originally thought was a Waterman "W".

I also noticed something I never saw before. A hint of red inside the impressions of the numbers?

Edited March 15, 2014 by Ray Cornett

[Guest Ray Cornett]

removed

Edited March 15, 2014 by Ray Cornett

[Left FPN]

though a 12PSF does this help,

 

[Guest Ray Cornett]

Mine has the 512 above where your 12 is and a PSF a little lower than the PSF mark on yours and what seems to me to be a very faint 1/2 in the center. I am going to try to get some photographs of it today.

[Left FPN]

http://www.vintagepens.com/FAQhistory/waterman_numbering.shtml

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/index.php/topic/188186-waterman-ideal-512-12-14-kt-filigree-gold-fountain-pen/

 

a little light reading here.....http://vintagewatermanpens.co.uk/waterman_stock_list.asp

[Guest Ray Cornett]

The numbering system page has always confused me a bit. Maybe I am over thinking it. But it seems to cancel itself out at one point. I also went through all the pens with 512 in them on the "light reading"site and didn't find my pen. The only other example I have ever seen of it is the one I posted an image of which was from another post on here where someone was selling one.

[Guest Ray Cornett]

In the numbering if it were 3 digits is it possible that if the first digit were a 0 would the 0 be smaller than the 12?

[Guest Ray Cornett]

I have some potentially decent macro shots I will post as soon as I make sure they are clear enough.

[Guest Ray Cornett]

Ok, here is what I was able to come up with for images right now. I enhances the spot where the numbers/letters are to make them stand out a little better. I will proabably do more later with my real camera and light set up. I got a shot of what seems to me to be a 512, a shot that shows part of the 1/2 which is very weak and faint, and the PSF.

Edit- I am adding a snapshot of the pen itself. Also upon viewing the photos it now looks like there may be a possibility of the last two numbers being 22 instead of 12 as I had thought I saw under the loupe. It seems the part I thought made it a one, a more vertical stroke, may be a dent inside of a 2....This may be a job for a forensics department at the local PD,lol.

Edited March 15, 2014 by Ray Cornett

[Xof72000]

Yes, I agree, it really looks like "512 1/2 PSF" to me.

So I would say it was made before 1917.

[Procyon]

To put an earlier boundary on it, I would also say 1908 or later, therefore, 1908-1917 would seem right. Before 1908, all overlays basically just used a two digit description.

[Uncle Red]

The 1/2 means this is the thin model. A 522 would have a very differant cap.

[Guest Ray Cornett]

Thank you all. So, the original date I saw a while back of 1908 makes sense. For a thin model it still feels nice in my hands. I have arthritis and normally thin pens give me trouble.

[Uncle Red]

Sorry, Waterman didn't market lever fillers until 1915. They ran through every other possible filler first.