Lamy Blue-Blacks, New Bottle Versus Cartridge

[lapis]

I have decided to drop this note as a separate topic instead of adding a reply to the recent comparison of old and new Lamy blue-blacks in the bottle because I have the feeling that there are a few of us who refrain from using iron-gall inks in general, and thus stick to non-iron-gall inks. That means that blue-black fans who love Lamy inks -- because if their availability and inexpensiveness -- may have addressed the question as to "Is the ink in the new bottles of this (since about December 2012) the same as that in the cartridges?"

 

Today's list price of Lamy blue-black in the 50-ml bottle is about 0.15 Euros/ml, whereas that of a 5-pack of cartridges is about 0.36 Euros/ml.

 

Whether or not you prefer a bottle of the old (iron-gall) Lamy blue-black or the new (non-iron-gall) Lamy blue-black, take into consideration the fact that both have the same bar code number. The bar code number on a 5-pack of cartridges is different:

 

So the question remains, "Are they one and the same ink?" I would say, "Yes".

 

Here is a scan of the usual paper chromatography I usually check out first as an at least halfway good analysis. I bought both inks on the 18^th of July 2013. LB = Lamy "bottle"; LC = Lamy "cartridge":

 

Again, that is no proof that both inks are identical, because the actual dye concentrations and/or the inclusion of tensides/surfactants are not easily seen using this type of chromatography.

 

Tensides/surfactants (both also known as detergents) are constituents which are added during the manufacturing of the ink in order to increase flow and lubrication. I experienced no difference at all in the flow or lubrication of these two inks. In any case, I also saw no difference in the actual colours of both inks on two types of paper. Also, no difference in feathering was seen. Rhodia 80 g/m² and Rhodia Yellow 90 g/m²:

 

As expected, I also saw no differences in bleeding (the papers -- from left to right -- are in the same order as that seen above)...

 

... Or in water resistance (after a complete submersion in water for 60 s):

 

The drying times, too, are both the same: 15-20s. (By comparison, the drying time of the old (pre December 2012) Lamy bottled blue-black is still about 55-60 s).

 

If you like blue-black inks, you like Lamy, and you don't want an iron-gall, then I'd say get today's bottled ink.

 

Crass

[The Good Captain]

Another wonderful comparative review. I like the ink and once I've found a nice wet pen in my cups, as it were (I use mugs etc to stand my pens in) I'll use the bottles B-B which is probably iron gall.

Let's see what this wonderful post brings out of the woods.

[lapis]

Thanks, but I think you're embarking on a new question, "Are pen mugs and beer mugs the same?"

[The Good Captain]

Thanks, but I think you're embarking on a new question, "Are pen mugs and beer mugs the same?"

No. One lot don't hold as much Twisted Spire as the other lot.

[lapis]

I mean, after all, the two look the same to me!

[The Good Captain]

I mean, after all, the two look the same to me!

Exactly - cheers!

[Sandy1]

Hi,

 

Many thanks for 'closing the circle' on the recent changes to Lamy BlBk.

 

For my related Comparisons & Review I used the Lamy BlBk in cartridges to represent the 'color component' version that was concurrent in the market with the I-G version in bottles. I'm glad to see that it was reasonable to assume that the CC version would go unchanged. (For once I was correct - not pranked!)

 

Bye,

S1

[lapis]

Hi,

 

Many thanks for 'closing the circle' on the recent changes to Lamy BlBk.

 

For my related Comparisons & Review I used the Lamy BlBk in cartridges to represent the 'color component' version that was concurrent in the market with the I-G version in bottles. I'm glad to see that it was reasonable to assume that the CC version would go unchanged. (For once I was correct - not pranked!)

 

Bye,

S1

Ahh, c'mon, we all know that you have been correct... and that more than once!

 

Mike

[The Good Captain]

And I still maintain that 4001 Blue-Black has all the iron-gall characteristics for an ink which, according to Hanover, isn't an iron-gall ink at all.

Or maybe it has a little. Also according to Hanover.

Isn't that so, Mike?

[lapis]

And I still maintain that 4001 Blue-Black has all the iron-gall characteristics for an ink which, according to Hanover, isn't an iron-gall ink at all.

Or maybe it has a little. Also according to Hanover.

Isn't that so, Mike?

As I recall, Hanover told me that their blue-black 4001 doesn't contain any iron-gall anymore since 26 years.

OTOH, that was just their "service department" and somebody else from Hanover had once said that today's b-b 4001 contains "much less iron-gall, if any at all".

The final line still remains that if I someday have the chance, I'd more than love to do a ferrous sulfate quantitative analysis.

[dontheo]

Lapis:

 

Great post, but now I am confused. I was looking around for an everyday pen that could get lost under the mounds of paperwork on my desk and if it never surfaced again, it would be no great loss. I ended up with three safari's and as they arrived from different sources, I put the cartridge in and loved them at once. I figured I would buy their ink too and bought a red, blue and tourquois. I have tried all three of the inks and am having thoughts of just tossing them.

 

My job does get stressful but maybe there is a huge difference between the cartridge and the bottled ink. Yet your analysis would say it my imagination or I should see a doctor:). I am kind of new to the fountain pen world so I figure I am missing something.

[lapis]

Lapis:

 

Great post, but now I am confused. I was looking around for an everyday pen that could get lost under the mounds of paperwork on my desk and if it never surfaced again, it would be no great loss. I ended up with three safari's and as they arrived from different sources, I put the cartridge in and loved them at once. I figured I would buy their ink too and bought a red, blue and tourquois. I have tried all three of the inks and am having thoughts of just tossing them.

 

My job does get stressful but maybe there is a huge difference between the cartridge and the bottled ink. Yet your analysis would say it my imagination or I should see a doctor:). I am kind of new to the fountain pen world so I figure I am missing something.

If I understand correctly, you seem to be unhappy and/or unconvinced about any Lamy inks. My suggestion -- as a fair comparison with Lamy -- would be to try out MB inks. I like all MB inks more than the Lamy inks. It was just a question whether this Lamy ink can compare with MB's "equivalent".

 

Mike