Parker 75 Uncommon Nib? - Has Anyone Seen One?

[RalphP]

I came across this nib recently and had to think about it a while... all made in USA nibs were thought to be 14k - not 18k.

 

Has anyone come across one of these?

 

 

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll110/pratherpens/P-75-18K-Nib-3_zpsdcynhhkr.jpg

 

 

Thanks, ralph prather

[Joane]

Yes. The Premier version of the 75 came with an 18k nib and the units are interchangeable.

[kirchh]

Yes. The Premier version of the 75 came with an 18k nib and the units are interchangeable.

 

I haven't seen that nib imprint on a Premier nib. Do you have a picture of one?

 

--Daniel

[Joane]

THe nibs were ordered directly from Parker. They have different finishing designs on the sections, as does yours yet again. From different years? Maybe someone else will know about the design changes.

 

Note: For aome reason my photo is showing upside down. I hope the details can be seen or the photo can be rotated by the viewer.

 

[kirchh]

THe nibs were ordered directly from Parker. They have different finishing designs on the sections, as does yours yet again. From different years? Maybe someone else will know about the design changes.

 

Note: For aome reason my photo is showing upside down. I hope the details can be seen or the photo can be rotated by the viewer.

 

image.jpeg

Do those nibs say "USA"?

 

--Daniel

[Joane]

Do those nibs say "USA"?

--Daniel

No, they are made in France. But apparently the USA ones were from earlier models from the '60s and '70s. Those deluxe 75 models may have had other names than Premier . Sorry if my info is not that helpful.

[joss]

I think that a "USA" stamped 18K nib is quite uncommon on a Parker 75.

I have never seen such a nib before.

 

Is the pen a Sterling Silver 75 (Made in USA)? And is there a number on the feed?

Edited April 4, 2016 by joss

[RalphP]

I think that a "USA" stamped 18K nib is quite uncommon on a Parker 75.

I have never seen such a nib before.

 

Is the pen a Sterling Silver 75 (Made in USA)? And is there a number on the feed?

 

Good Question. Yes, the pen is the sterling silver crosshatch. It is an early example based on flat tassies, "0" reference ring on the tassie, narrow band on the cap marked with the standard "Made in U.S.A.". There are a couple of other odd marks on the band i hadn't noticed before - will have to look at them again under magnification.

 

Surprised again - there is no marking on the feed at all showing the the size of the nib - in the time period I suspect it was made (c. 1964) there should have been a number and not a letter indicating the size of the nib..

 

Here is a picture of the pen: (the top one)

 

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll110/pratherpens/P-75-18k-Nib_zps7iv1dmgp.jpg

 

 

The more I look at this pen - the curiouser and curiouser it becomes...

 

 

(the blank oval marks on the nib look a bit like the hallmarks of the 18k nibs made in France?)

[mitto]

The letter on the feed instead of the numbers is not a big issue as the nib unit may be a replacement one but the 18k stamping on a 'made in USA' nib needs further exploration. All my 18k nibs are French made. May be pens made in USA with this specific nib were meant for export to French market. Just sharing thoughts.

Edited April 4, 2016 by mitto

[Ernst Bitterman]

I speculate, in line with Mitto: Noticing the "Argent Massif Cisele" on the box, perhaps there were small runs of 18K points run up in the US factory to meet the French national requirements as far as claiming something to be actual gold, intended for sale only in France. It may have been considered less of an expense/inconvenience to do that than to set up the 75-specific tooling at Parker's establishment in France.

 

I notice, without full comprehension, the absence of the eagle-head assay mark that I've seen on French-made points, too.

Edited April 4, 2016 by Ernst Bitterman

[mitto]

...and the fact that the nib is found on a first year/early production pen, when production of 75 in France was not yet there, gives further credence to this speculation. May be someone with definite information chime in.

[RalphP]

The letter on the feed instead of the numbers is not a big issue as the nib unit may be a replacement one but the 18k stamping on a 'made in USA' nib needs further exploration. All my 18k nibs are French made. May be pens made in USA with this specific nib were meant for export to French market. Just sharing thoughts.

 

There are no letters or numbers on the feed - completely smooth - will post some pictures later... I agree it must have something to do with the French market... thanks, ralph

[RalphP]

I speculate, in line with Mitto: Noticing the "Argent Massif Cisele" on the box, perhaps there were small runs of 18K points run up in the US factory to meet the French national requirements as far as claiming something to be actual gold, intended for sale only in France. It may have been considered less of an expense/inconvenience to do that than to set up the 75-specific tooling at Parker's establishment in France.

 

I notice, without full comprehension, the absence of the eagle-head assay mark that I've seen on French-made points, too.

 

 

There are "oval marks" on the nib - perhaps where the eagle-head assay could have gone - have to check some French made nibs...

 

Wonder if a country - other than France - is allowed to use French Hallmarks - don't know... just asking... thanks, ralph

[RalphP]

The first photo below shows the feed devoid of any markings regarding size of the nib - and to the right the bottom of the narrow band cap. At first glance i thought there were some tarnished places - not uncommon - but on closer examination it appeared that there were some hallmarks (in addition to the customary or expected "PARKER Sterling Silver Made in U.S.A.& arrow halo mark")

 

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll110/pratherpens/P-75-18kNib-Cap_zpsbd2q5vct.jpg

 

 

The "hallmarks" are sort of visible but the next photo of just the cap band shows them a little more clearly.

 

 

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll110/pratherpens/P-75--18k-Cap_zpsq9myhhro.jpg

 

 

The mark on the right, "PP and an arrow", was - if i recall correctly, meant to convey "made by Parker" (a little redundant?).

 

Anyway, one thing leads to another - now to locate a chart of hallmarks used by Parker in France...

 

Thanks for any observations - ralph

[kirchh]

See this post.

 

--Daniel

[RalphP]

See this post.

 

--Daniel

 

Thanks Daniel - the one on the right with the narrow band seems to be the same - much cleaner too... would like to see a picture of the nib for that cap and see if the ovals in the nib were imprinted... ralph

 

ralph

[ceejaybee]

The nibs on my Sterling pens shown in the earlier thread are both French made with relevant hallmarks for French (not imported) gold, this is the only nib type I've ever seen on an early Sterling 75 produced for the French market.

 

http://i865.photobucket.com/albums/ab212/ceejaybee_photo/early18k.jpg

 

 

I would suspect yours is a nib produced soon after the launch of the Sterling 75 in the U.S.A., Parker did seem keen to export these into Europe straight away but Hallmarking restrictions meant they had to tweek the design a little. I've seen 1st year pens turn up in Germany were hallmarks are not required although the nib did have the addition of a .585 mark. The U.K. needed the clip and tassies to be made from precious metals too to meet their hallmarking requirements so they didn't turn up until 1965 and of course France required 18K nibs, I had thought that Parker waited until nib production started in Meru in the late 1960s to launch the 75 in France but your nib suggests it was considering making the 18K nibs in the U.S.A. before this which would make perfect sense.

 

Can I ask how you came about the pen? It appears to be the correct French retail package apart from the nib, I wonder if it was actually imported into France and later returned to the U.S.A.? I studied your photos and I think I can see the Weevil Import marks on the cap which I think would only be applied in France, the detail inside the two rectangular stamps appears to be there and not blank like the oval mark to the left on the nib. The nib has the PP makers mark but apparently no mark for imported gold, maybe it didn't meet the French gold standard for some reason and the pen (or batch of pens) was returned to the U.S.A. unstamped?

[ceejaybee]

I've studied the nib markings again and think I can see a faint imprint of the weevil within the oval to the left, is it possible for you to check it with a loupe/magnifier? I think I can make out the body and 2 legs to the right which within an oval would be correct for imported gold, imported silver is the same mark within a rectangle. I'm now reconsidering that this could possibly be an early French retail package, Parker definitely went to a lot more trouble than simply making a nib to modify the U.S.A. version to comply with the UK assay office as early as 1965 so it seems logical to make 18K nibs to get it onto the French market ASAP. If it was retailed in France with this nib then the question is now why have other examples not come to light before now?

 

I also wondered if it had the PP imprint on the barrel tassie? This seems to be usual on the flat tassie pens produced for France.

 

http://i865.photobucket.com/albums/ab212/ceejaybee_photo/USAwithHallmarks_Dsc_6141.jpg

[RalphP]

The nibs on my Sterling pens shown in the earlier thread are both French made with relevant hallmarks for French (not imported) gold, this is the only nib type I've ever seen on an early Sterling 75 produced for the French market.

 

http://i865.photobucket.com/albums/ab212/ceejaybee_photo/early18k.jpg

 

 

I would suspect yours is a nib produced soon after the launch of the Sterling 75 in the U.S.A., Parker did seem keen to export these into Europe straight away but Hallmarking restrictions meant they had to tweek the design a little. I've seen 1st year pens turn up in Germany were hallmarks are not required although the nib did have the addition of a .585 mark. The U.K. needed the clip and tassies to be made from precious metals too to meet their hallmarking requirements so they didn't turn up until 1965 and of course France required 18K nibs, I had thought that Parker waited until nib production started in Meru in the late 1960s to launch the 75 in France but your nib suggests it was considering making the 18K nibs in the U.S.A. before this which would make perfect sense.

 

Can I ask how you came about the pen? It appears to be the correct French retail package apart from the nib, I wonder if it was actually imported into France and later returned to the U.S.A.? I studied your photos and I think I can see the Weevil Import marks on the cap which I think would only be applied in France, the detail inside the two rectangular stamps appears to be there and not blank like the oval mark to the left on the nib. The nib has the PP makers mark but apparently no mark for imported gold, maybe it didn't meet the French gold standard for some reason and the pen (or batch of pens) was returned to the U.S.A. unstamped?

 

 

Thanks for the information - I've had the pen over ten years and only fairly recently "re-discovered" it... it is probable that the pen came in the box but am not absolutely certain. The initial highlight of the purchase was the box. Somewhere on the Parker 75 site (credit for photo) is a picture of a slightly newer similar box (note the wide band on the pen) - perhaps used by the factory in France in the late 1970s... seem to recall that the "Argent Massif Ciselé" the first reference that the silver "crosshatch was called "Ciselé" & the whole story that goes with that.

 

http://www.parker75.addr.com/Reference/Cisele/Cisele_word_proof_2_found.JPG

credit for photo Parker75.com

 

 

"The nib has the PP makers mark but apparently no mark for imported gold, maybe it didn't meet the French gold standard for some reason and the pen (or batch of pens) was returned to the U.S.A. unstamped?"

 

Interesting possibility...

[mitto]

The first photo below shows the feed devoid of any markings regarding size of the nib - and to the right the bottom of the narrow band cap. At first glance i thought there were some tarnished places - not uncommon - but on closer examination it appeared that there were some hallmarks (in addition to the customary or expected "PARKER Sterling Silver Made in U.S.A.& arrow halo mark")

 

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll110/pratherpens/P-75-18kNib-Cap_zpsbd2q5vct.jpg

 

 

The "hallmarks" are sort of visible but the next photo of just the cap band shows them a little more clearly.

 

 

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll110/pratherpens/P-75--18k-Cap_zpsq9myhhro.jpg

 

 

The mark on the right, "PP and an arrow", was - if i recall correctly, meant to convey "made by Parker" (a little redundant?).

 

Anyway, one thing leads to another - now to locate a chart of hallmarks used by Parker in France...

 

Thanks for any observations - ralph

 

You may see here for hallmarks used in France:

 

http://parkerpens.net/codekey.html