Nibs With Osmium, Ruthenium, Platinum Or Electrum?

[Helios]

I have been glossing over several pens but it has occurred to me that AFAIK, none of them have nibs composed of ruthenium, osmium, electrum, palladium and even surprisingly, platinum.

 

I am pretty sure there are pens with platinum nibs but I haven't found one yet. But are there any for the others? It does not have to be 24K, it does not even have to be 14K. Even if plated or tipped would also do. I am not asking this question out of buying one but rather just satiating my curiosity.

 

 

Thanks

Edited January 31, 2016 by Helios

[Uncial]

I think all of the Visconti Dreamtouch nibs are now palladium rather than gold and have somewhat mixed reviews.

The Montblanc 145P has a nib that is platinum plated (along with rings and clip). Not sure if any of the other Meisterstuck range has it.

Edited January 31, 2016 by Uncial

[Parker51]

Sheaffer's when it was in business used to produce a palladium silver nib. It was and is a great nib. You just have to go vintage Snorkel or PFM to get it.

[jar]

The Parker pens with their Octanium nibs might check all your boxes at once.

[Randal6393]

It occurs to me that the original "iridium" pellets had traces and mixes of all these elements in them. The modern noble-metal pellets used for the tip of fountain pen nibs, both steel and gold, might have some of these metals as well. Remember, two factors dictated the choice of gold and iridium for a modern fountain pen, ability to do the job and resistance to corrosion.

 

The nibs are somewhat like the historical Japanese samurai swords. Swords were made of folded metals, pounded together under high heat (I know, an oversimplification for the purposes of this discussion.) The ultimate goal was to produce a flexible blade that had a strong, sharp edge backed by a flexible, yielding blade that would protect the edge from shattering. The choice of iron was important but the major factor in the sword was the working and folding of the metals.

 

In a similar manner, a fountain pen nib is a formed edge that is strong, backed with the nib shaft that holds it in place and gives to protect the writing sweet spot. Materials are chosen to provide maximum function. So it is irrelevant, to some extent, whether one uses platinum or iridium, gold or steel. As long as the pen works and does not corrode (too swiftly).

 

Enjoy,

[hari317]

I have been glossing over several pens but it has occurred to me that AFAIK, none of them have nibs composed of ruthenium, osmium, electrum, palladium and even surprisingly, platinum.

The first two pens at the following link have nibs made from solid Platinum.

 

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dwww.platinum-pen.co.jp%26newwindow%3D1%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26hs%3DzrU%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26channel%3Drcs&rurl=translate.google.co.in&sandbox=0&sl=ja&u=http://www.platinum-pen.co.jp/fountain_metal.html&usg=ALkJrhhsRiTuYY3i0HoOv_Ma92HFj-D5LA

[Bo Bo Olson]

Osmium...was discovered @ 1922 or a bit before, the Heidelberg Professor who discovered it, sold it to what became because of the name Osmia pen company. For many years it was one of the very best tipping material.

There has been a lot of mixing of rare earth elements since Iridium was first used. It was in the 1880-90s called the diamond point. It was very rare, at that time being mined from an inch or so deep layer in Italy. It came from the asteroid that killed the dinosaurs. There was a world wide covering buy it is often only a hair thick.

Many of the rare elements were discovered about then or a bit later.

 

In 'iridium' and other rare earth elements are more much expensive than gold...no one would waste money really trying to make a full better nib out of it. The tipping mixtures changed from era to era and with in the same company very often. I read something where Parker was changing tipping mixtures almost every year in the '30's.

 

I had thought Sheaffer had gone to Palladium silver because of the war...but I could be very wrong, in I have my Snorkel...gold, and that is it.

Palladium Silver:

A middle ground between steel and gold, palladium silver nibs tend to be very shiny. They usually are very smooth with little feedback, and they keep their shininess for long amounts of time. These nibs were common in vintage pens, when palladium was cheaper, but nowadays, gold tends to be the gold standard. Very high end fountain pens sometimes use 21kt Palladium nibs instead of gold to opt for the brilliant shine.

 

Per a Parker brochure introducing this nib material on the Parker 51 model, Octanium is an alloy composed of eight different metals, each chosen for certain attributes:

Strength and hardness:

40% Cobalt

15% Nickel

20% Chromium

High resilience:

7% Molybdenum

2% Manganese

15% Iron (approximately)

Additional strength against all stresses and climatic conditions:

0.04% Beryllium

0.15% Carbon

 

 

In WW2, the process of tipping became perfected. Before that nibs could have lumps on them and sometimes the lumps tore out of the tipping.

 

Platinum came into jewelry in the 20th century in no one had the means to do much with Platinum. It required a much higher industrialization than was available in the 19th century.

 

This is a great place, one can relearn so much.

[Helios]

The Parker pens with their Octanium nibs might check all your boxes at once.

I have looked up octanium nib composition, and they are made of the same materials as Olson, mentioned. So would it really tick the boxes? Meh. But it certainly is interesting to see nibs with such a unique composition.

 

So I presume that electrum is the only alloy that has never been really made in fountain pen nibs, even in history?

[dfo]

I have looked up octanium nib composition, and they are made of the same materials as Olson, mentioned. So would it really tick the boxes? Meh. But it certainly is interesting to see nibs with such a unique composition.

 

So I presume that electrum is the only alloy that has never been really made in fountain pen nibs, even in history?

 

 

Electrum is a loose term used to denote both natural and artificial alloys of gold and with at least 20% silver. Most 10 ct or 14 ct gold alloys fall into that category.

Edited February 1, 2016 by dfo

[Piper 987]

I have been glossing over several pens but it has occurred to me that AFAIK, none of them have nibs composed of ruthenium, osmium, electrum, palladium and even surprisingly, platinum.

 

I am pretty sure there are pens with platinum nibs but I haven't found one yet. But are there any for the others? It does not have to be 24K, it does not even have to be 14K. Even if plated or tipped would also do. I am not asking this question out of buying one but rather just satiating my curiosity.

 

Consider that a fountain pen nib should be considered to be made of two parts; the small bit where the ink actually gets laid out on the paper and all the rest of the nib. Those two parts may or may not be made of the same material.

 

They have very different functions to perform. Nib manufacturers (who may or may not make pens as well) have tried a variety of various metals and alloys to get a nib to do what they want it to do. The nib body may be designed to not flex, flex somewhat or flex so much it's referred to as a "wet-noodle". Depending on the tip (extra-fine, double broad etc.) the flow of ink to the point must be different.

 

Now consider the actual tip. It has to be hard and durable. Paper is minimally abrasive. 24K gold would wear away in very short order. It also has to be soft enough to be ground, shaped and polished.

 

Years ago a nib body was very likely to be made of 14K or 18K gold. What the manufacturer alloyed with the gold was often a trade secret. The actual writing tip material was even more of a secret, concocted by gnomes working deep underground in hidden cavern/metallurgy labs.

 

Iridium was always a trade word for whatever was used to make the writing tip of a fountain pen nib. It may or may not have contained actual iridium, which is a very scarce metal on the earth's surface. So, "Iridium Tipped" simply meant that something other than the nib body material made up the tip.

 

Some nib manufacturers did use various amounts of real iridium in their tipping material. Metals such as platinum, osmium, ruthenium, silver, tungsten, gold, rhodium and even cobalt have gone into various recipes for the ultimate tipping material.

 

Of course, good old stainless steel makes for excellent nibs all by itself.

[Ramchandra]

I know that this is a very late reply but I think Ratnam Pens do sell pens with platinum tips,

correct me if I am wrong though

[Freddy]

I know that this is a very late reply but I think Ratnam Pens do sell pens with platinum tips,

correct me if I am wrong though

Firstly..Welcome Aboard....Enjoy your time here...

 

Re: "I think Ratnam Pens do sell pens with platinum tips,"

 

Ramchandra, please provide citation{s}....Any primary source material will do......{or secondary}.

 

Look forward to your reply.

Thank you,

 

Fred

[Bo Bo Olson]

"""I think Ratnam Pens do sell pens with platinum tips,""""

 

Rare earths ..... platinum is one.

There was a post by a good poster about what rare earths and what combinations were used in the '20-30's. It may have been that there were nib tipping made with platinum as a small part of the compound....but from what I remember ... platinum was not a major component often not at all. . Often tungsten was.....being cheaper.

Iridium not at all, being much too expensive....being mined from 1-2" strip mines in Italy and later Turkey.

 

The rare earths are called platinum group.....don't mean the nib is made of pure nor a majority of platinum As mentioned, ruthenium, osmium, electrum, palladium and platinum are part of the group and others too..

 

I think had pure or mostly platinum nib tipping been any good it would have been used often and much earlier. Iridium was used at first in it was easier to use than a ruby.

 

Osmium; a rare earth was patented into a compound as mentioned @ 1922, that was one of the better tipping compounds from the '20-60's with Osmia and perhaps later with Degussa, who took control of Osmia's nib factory for debt in 1932. The tipping was so good, the Boehler brothers named the company after it Osmia.....osmium. That tipping was so good, normal folks besides the trained sales force of the 'Ol' German Corner Pen Shoppe, knew of it.

Knowing that I was surprised Osmium was not used or much used in the US companies listed with the tipping compounds. Don't know how wide or how many patents with that element the Heidelberg professor had.

 

Platinum is much harder than gold......gold makes diamond in jewelry yellow, so diamonds were set in silver cups to be bright before the real early 1900-1910. Platinum being so hard, it allowed jewels to be set with less material getting in the way of the light to gleam the jewel.

 

((White gold was invented in @ 1910.....but platinum remained a at least top surface/plating of late Art Nouveau and Art Deco jewelry.....in spite that white gold did as well and was cheaper....it just didn't hold the jewel clear with less material as did platinum.))) The tipping procedure was perfected in WW2. It wasn't until the late '30's or even early '50's, that white gold replaced platinum as cheaper ... easier to work with. Not better.

 

At various times not only platinum but other rare earths were more expensive than gold...still are in many cases........but slapstick engineer teams, spent decades fiddling with tipping compounds trying to make a nib tip last 7-10 years cheaper than the competitors.

[OMASsimo]

Ouch!!! As a chemistry professor I do have to intervene here, sorry. The elements in question are all not rare earths. The rare earths are scandium, ytterbium, and the row from lanthanum through lutetium. The metals in question are just normal transition metals belonging to the platinum group (Ru, Rh, Pd, Os, Ir, Pt), which together with Re, Cu, Ag, Au, and Hg form the group of noble metals due to their resistance with respect to corrosion. They are of interest here because of their special properties. All of them except platinum are exceptionally hard and thus suitable as tipping material.

 

All of these metals were discovered by the early 1800s and some were known even longer. First, there was little use for them and they are very rare, despite not being rare earths. But when the idea came along to put a very hard tipping on a nib, these were the right materials. So, alloys like osmiridium, a naturally found alloy, were used early on. It seems that tungsten alloys were used as well for the same reasons. Osmium in pure form is extremely poisonous and most likely never was used like this. And iridium is so expensive that most likely it has been a very minor component of the tipping material if it was contained at all. The well-known "Iridium Point" might just be a branding with no connection to the tipping material at all. Anyway, the company Osmia, named after the element osmium, indeed was renowned for its robust nibs. They trusted their patented osmium containing tipping alloy enough to be the first company in Germany to offer a lifetime warranty on the nib and tipping. And indeed, none of my several Osmias shows any wear on the tipping.

[corgicoupe]

Whew! As a metallurgist who did a PhD on defects in platinum, I'm glad that you made your contribution in this discussion.

[Ramchandra]

Thanks for the warm welcome Fred.

 

And I got this link which may help one to get in touch with the manufacturer as it contains their contact info:

https://m.facebook.com/Ratnam-pens-314421885386511/photos/?ref=page_internal&mt_nav=0

[Bo Bo Olson]

Ah Ha.......!!!!

"""Anyway, the company Osmia, named after the element osmium, indeed was renowned for its robust nibs. They trusted their patented osmium containing tipping alloy enough to be the first company in Germany to offer a lifetime warranty on the nib and tipping. And indeed, none of my several Osmias shows any wear on the tipping."""

I do have 7-8 of the Osmia and or Boehler pens............do have Degussa nibs also.....so expect the Degussa nib to be the same as the Osmia, in Degussa took over Osmia's nib factory in 1932 for debt. Osmia didn't have a office supply business like Soennecken, MB, Pelikan and later Geha keeping the pen division going, so kept going broke.

 

Was just reading a couple months ago, of some scientists did some alchemy with platinum and gold ending up with a super hard compound that they expect to use in the throat of rocket motors...........among other such things.

Struck me as perfect Science Fiction...so added that to a SF book that is standing in my writing line.

Edited May 13, 2019 by Bo Bo Olson

[Bo Bo Olson]

Ramchandra, If you could dig out the exact info it would be nice, in I don't Face nor Twit so don't know how to dig any info out of that pen company in facebook..

[Ramchandra]

Bo Bo Olson Here is his card and some images I got from the manufacturer​

​

[Bo Bo Olson]

Very pretty pens.