Stub And Italic Nibs?

[Blazing]

Hello,

 

I've been using fountain pens daily for my school work, and I've been loving the experience so far. I've been using medium nibs on all of my three pens, but the Pilot MR is Japanese so it would probably be considered as a fine nib. It's been brought to my attention that stubs nibs and italic nibs may be worth a try. Although my handwriting isn't like that of a traditional style with many curves [it's more modern with straighter lines etc], I believe that it may be worth a try.

 

My questions are:

- Are stub and italic nibs suitable for fast writing? [i have to take notes in school.]

- What is the difference between stub and italic nibs?

- What pens would you recommend which have stub and/or italic nib options?

 

Thank you.

[BBU]

For the second question, this link clarifies the different nib terms well:

 

http://www.richardspens.com/?page=ref/nibs/primer.htm

 

Sorry, I can't answer the other two questions.

[rdh]

You might try the Pilot Plumix to see if they work for you. They are inexpensive and you might be able to get them at Staples. Really a stub is a bit of a rounded off italic, so you don't get as much line variation, but it is smoother for writing. If you like the Plumix, you can transfer the nib to the MR . You can use these for fast writing, but they don't give the same calligraphy-like look to your writing as when you write slowly.

 

Have fun trying them out.

 

Dave

[Blazing]

I think the stub may appeal to me more. I've also been noticing that my Faber Castell Loom has showed signs of a little bit of line variation, things like my greater than/less than signs and letters such as f, g, j, q and y are wider in some parts and more narrow in other parts.

[Tonkus]

I have trouble writing fast with my TWSBI stub nib. It seems to be too critical of nib alignment.

[Ghost Plane]

Went all through grad school + career writing at speed with stubs. Much depends on budget. Fountain Pen Hospital had a special on Pelikan italics yesterday for great price (US)

[WirsPlm]

The smaller and smoother an italic, the faster and easier you can write with it. The Plumix is a good idea, or also look for an F italic in a Sheaffer NoNonsense or Sheaffer calligraphy sets (older sets with translucent pens, not the newer ones with an oblong hole in the barrel). There's also the Pilot 78G B nib, but that's closer to a regular italic and a little drier and harder to use than the Plumix or the Sheaffer. Plumix takes Pilot cartridges or converters, the Sheaffers take Sheaffer cartridges and might take a push-in Sheaffer converter (never bothered to try, I just refill the carts).

 

I've found that the Pilot MR M nib is close to a US/EU M, it's Pilot Fs and XFs that are smaller than US/EU makers typically run (manufacturing tolerances and YM may vary)

Edited January 15, 2014 by WirsPlm

[dooooooor]

I find that writing at normal speed with a stub or cursive italic up to 1.1mm is pretty doable. I have to slow down a bit when I'm using my 1.5mm stub on a 580. Also, you need to write a bit slower with crisper italics or you could end up cutting the page (like I have with my Italix Parson's Essential fine italic, which is crisper than my other CIs).

 

Italic nibs are my favorite! You should definitely try one out at least. As previously mentioned the Plumix is cheap. and if you have a safari you can switch to a 1.1mm to try out. The Pilot 78g B is also a stub and it's usually cheap.

[Tangster]

I regularly write with a stub nib. It's harder to write fast with a sharp italic because they are very placement critical due to their sharp nib edges tearing the paper if you place it wrong, but a cursive italic or stub is fine for rapid note taking.

[RMN]

You start with standard round nibs, then you have stub which could be called oval, then you have cursive italic (let's say gherkin shaped) and at last crisp (or formal) italic which is like a brick, no round edges.

 

A round nib usually has a very wide sweet spot, the tilt of the pen is not critical. A crisp italic should be exactly in one position, otherwise the nib won't properly touch the paper and you will be dragging the edge over the paper, resulting in cuts. So a crisp italic will not be good for fast writing, unless you have really superb motor skills.

 

On the other hand, a round nib has no line variation (uotside of some flex) and the crisp italic has maximum line variation.

 

Personally a 0.9 to 1.1 cursive italic is ideal for normal writing IMHO. It really enhances your script.

 

D.ick

[brunico]

- Are stub and italic nibs suitable for fast writing? [i have to take notes in school.]

 

Yes. With a proper hold and some familiarity, every bit as fast as a regular nib. If you rock the nib from side to side, then no.

 

Though a truly sharp italic nib, like a Brause Bandzug dip pen, requires more care, I find that the smaller sizes (e.g., 0.5mm, 0.75mm and 1mm) can be handled fairly rapidly: reloading with ink is the major drag here.

 

- What is the difference between stub and italic nibs?

 

Don't worry too much: I've seen the same nib described on this forum as everything from a stub through a cursive italic (rounded) to a crisp italic (sharp), so seeing a writing sample is the only way to check that you and someone else are speaking the same language.

 

To me, a stub is more of a regular nib that's ground to give some line variation - it's a bit shy of being an italic, if you like - and an italic is a nib that's been cut like a chisel, though pretty much all italic fountain pen nibs have their edges smoothed off to a degree. But everyone has their own idea about the distinctions.

 

- What pens would you recommend which have stub and/or italic nib options?

 

A Pilot Plumix (as has been said, you can put the nib into your MR, among other Pilot pens like the Prera). Other relatively inexpensive options include the Lamy Safari/Al-Star etc., the Twsbi 580, the Pelikan Script, the Rotring ArtPen and various calligraphy sets.

 

Oddly enough, there's more choice at the less expensive end of the market. Some manufacturers don't bother with italics until you're spending several hundred dollars, and then only on specific models, at which point it's often cheaper to get the pen you really want and get the nib ground to order.

[Tangster]

imo, crisp/sharp italic:

http://i.imgur.com/1J1Gx9L.jpg

 

Cursive italic:

http://i.imgur.com/ESJTnRM.jpg

 

I currently don't have any stubs, having reground them to cursive italics.

 

I did find this useful doodle on the franklin-christoph website though:

http://www.franklin-christoph.com/uploads/1/0/4/5/10453260/6762593_orig.jpg

Edited January 16, 2014 by Tangster

[OiRogers]

Stubs work great for daily full speed writing for me. I find that true italics require me to slow down and concentrate on my strokes and angles... As a result, my handwriting is much, much neater.

 

I have gone from loving EF nibs toward broader nibs to preferring stubs and italics for almost everything.

[csacks]

Do not worry about fast writing with a stub. If your nib is wet enough, you will not have problem with it.

To check, I would recommend a nib not bigger than 1,1 mm (1,5 may demand a very big calligraphy).

Lamy sells nibs of that size, and TWSBI as well, in case you may not want to buy a full FP.

I have used both of them and my TWSBI Vac 700 is just spectacular. The advantage is that the ink capacity of the 700 is huge, so will not run low of ink in a single day.

[bogiesan]

I must disagree with the recommendation for the older Sheaffer calligraphy sets. Even the very old units were fitted with cheap, stamped sheet metal nibs. The older pens, like their modern cousins, are suitable for calligraphy, not writing. These things have no tipping material and the edges and corners are knife blades. The slightest inattention while stroking and they will dig into your paper and will easily spatter ink.

 

Many of the older Sheaffer calligraphy pens I have seen (I do not own any) appeared to have been tweaked. I have rounded the edges and corners of several of the more recent nib units by a few strokes on an Arkansas stone. My results are mixed although I highly recommend experimentation to improve the writability of these cheap pens.

 

What I like about the only stub I have used (I do not won any) was the blob of tipping and the meticulous work that went into shaping it into the perfect writing instrument. It was fun and smooth and allowed dramatic personalization of my standard hand. I do not believe I have ever used an equally finely tuned italic nib.

[ac12]

My opinion...

Forget using an italic for school notes. Leave the italic for home or casual use.

The reason is space. The italic nib is wider than a standard nib, so you will use up more paper to write a word. So you get less words on a line and thus less words on a page. And if you have to jam/insert text between lines, and make various inserted notes to your notes, the italic is too fat to do that. And if you have any class that you have to copy down a illustration or a chart, and you need to label the chart, the italic is too fat for that kind of stuff. Well maybe if you use the entire page for that one illustration/chart. I had trouble doing that with an old F nib, I could not do that with a 1.1 italic nib.

 

I used an old Parker F nib (1970s), which is about the same as a Lamy XF nib for my note taking in college.

 

I recently was taking notes at a meeting where I was glad that I had a Chinese F nib pen with me as I had to insert notes into my notes and draw charts with lots of small labels. I could write small and still read the labels on the chart. That Chinese F nib was like an old Parker XF nib. Could I have used a wider nib, yes, but the notes probably would have been messier and the chart LARGER. What I am saying is the XF nib gave me options that I would not have with a wider nib.

Edited January 16, 2014 by ac12

[I like mango cheesecake]

I have a 1.1 TWSBI stub and I can write fast. I take lots of notes at work and I can write as fast as I type, about 40 - 50 wpm or more. It should be no problem to write fast especially on a really good stub nib like those on TWSBI's. I have a home ground italic nib and I cannot write as fast as I want to. I've since rounded off some of the sharpness and found its sweet spot so it no longer digs into the paper. Granted I could still write with the original home grind profile, but I had to be careful with it. That means writing slower. I've also home ground another nib, but that's at .9mm and that one I can write super fast as well..

 

I don't fully agree that a stub takes up more real estate on the paper. I can write with the same amount of words on a stub as I can on a M nib. When the stub goes beyond 1.5mm then, it's a different story.

[Runnin_Ute]

Since you already have a Safari, a good inexpensive way to try out an italic/stub/ci is a Lamy 1.1 mm nib. (I haven't tried the 1.5 or 1.9's) I put one on my Al Star, which has the same feed section and uses the same nib, replacing the fine I had on it and other than one partial fill a couple of weeks ago, it is all I have used on that pen since I got the nib 6-9 months ago. I can write pretty fast with it. Right now I have it filled with Noodler's Apache Sunset, but I don't like that ink in it as much as some others (Diamine Classic Red comes to mind) and I love the way Apache Sunset shades. I actually like it better out of my Pelikan 120 EF than the Lamy 1.1 mm. It is very nice with a Goulet B in my Noodler's Konrad.

 

The Lamy 1.1 will cost you about $12 - $15 at Goulet pens. Good inexpensive way to try it. If you like it you can try other italic/stub nibs. Or just get another Safari/Al Star or Vista.

[ac12]

I agree with Ute, get a Lamy 1.1 nib and give it a try.

I used a Lamy 1.1 to do my Christmas cards, and it could do cursive/script just fine.

[lahlahlaw]

I say get a Nemosine Singularity with a 0.6 stub, I have two and they are definitely usable for fast writing. I don't know of any other pens even close to this price range ($15) that offer this width of stub. In the worst scenario that you are not happy with it, you can simply swap in a #6 nib from Nemosine, Goulet, etc.