Intended Use Of A Pen

[swafran]

I absolutely loved my M600. Smooth, elegant, a lot like myself really.

 

Then on vacation it rolled off a shelf (about 1.2 m high) onto plastic flooring. And broke cleanly in half right above the nib.

 

No crush, no spidering, just a very clean fracture, leaving the nib and its support screwed into the cap.

 

So I wrote Pelikan and said I was sold a bad pen. I was nice about it, I mean this happens occasionally, even with the best of QA, there can be a bad batch or a glitch on one pen out of many produced.

 

Their answer was that the pen falling is not intended use.

 

I agreed, intended use is probably writing with the pen, not falling off of things (makes sense to me!) but that a pen that break that easily is defective from the start. I didn't get a reply.

 

I thought of a use for my pen I intended for them, but kept that for myself.

 

I'm saving the email for hilarity, and looking for another brand of pen, as reliability is more important to me than the admittedly smashing good looks of the Souverän. I'll still keep using 4001 ink, of the ones I've tried so far it is my favorite.

[View from the Loft]

I'm sorry, but I think you are being really unfair to Pelikan. Your pen was not defective - it broke due to impact. Designing a pen that will survive every type of impact would render it unusable as a pen.

[JonDoh]

A more expensive Montblanc made of resin would likely shatter from a drop like that. Send your pen in to Pelikan for repair and I'm sure they will treat you fairly. I dropped my Polar Lights a half meter and bent the nib. I suppose I could have argued that the nib should have withstood that type of drop. I didn't and sent it into Pelikan for repair and told them what happened. They were more than fair to me in handling the repair. I couldn't be happier with Pelikan repair and customer service.

[dragos.mocanu]

I'm sorry, but I think you are being really unfair to Pelikan. Your pen was not defective - it broke due to impact. Designing a pen that will survive every type of impact would render it unusable as a pen.

 

 

Try this for size: https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/index.php/topic/92073-the-lamy-2000-experiment/ And Lamy does update their design if it proves to be faulty (see the major 2009 change).

 

And no, I don't believe that a 1.2m fall should fracture the plastic like that..the M600 is not a very heavy pen, so the force of impact is quite small. The problem is not necesarily with QC, but with the overal manufacturer's attitude towards the acquisition and use of modern fountain pens. Despite it being a rather simple everyday tool that hasn't suffered much change over the course of a century, it is increasingly treated less like a writing tool, and more as an elegant accesory, which is very fine by me, but the utility part should not be sacrificed for better looks and/or lower production costs=>higher profit. Personally I hate ballpoints, so I couldn't imagine writing with anything but a fountain pen, hence, I take the utilitarian part quite seriously (that's why I tend to use time-proven pens, like the Parker "51"&45, the Lamy 2000 etc).

 

@JonDoh, the two pens (M600 and the more expensive MB) are made out of virtually the same material (same chemical structure...different branding), which they also used in making the Parker "51" (again...different branding). Also, the nib cannot whitstand the same force of impact as the plastic without bending out of shape, because of the different way and angle that force spreads through the different materials.

Edited September 19, 2014 by dragos.mocanu

[swafran]

So the pen dropped from 1.20 m onto plastic (not stone) and this was the result (pic). If that is expected for this pen, then imho I am correct in not wanting another one.

[Ernst Bitterman]

It's not a long drop, but one has to ponder the precise angle of the strike-- the vector of the force can be as important as the amount. The pen in this case struck in an unlucky way, and it probably would have been better to start the exchange with "This pen had an accident" than "This pen is bad." The people at Pelikan are people and accusation will tend to put them into an antagonistic stance. At least in the eyes of the North American distributor, act of dog is considered something a warranty can cover if you ask in the right tone.

 

...the two pens (M600 and the more expensive MB) are made out of virtually the same material (same chemical structure...different branding), which they also used in making the Parker "51" (again...different branding)....

 

 

MBs and Pelikans are made out of Lucite?

[swafran]

@dragos : actually, that's an interesting point. The answer may not be a different brand, but an older pen. I would also think they made them stronger back when pens were seen as essential business tools. Stronger than mine was, anyways (yes I'm still traumatized, sniff). It certainly would be in line with many other products that used to be made more solidly than they are today.

[dragos.mocanu]

It's not a long drop, but one has to ponder the precise angle of the strike-- the vector of the force can be as important as the amount. The pen in this case struck in an unlucky way, and it probably would have been better to start the exchange with "This pen had an accident" than "This pen is bad." The people at Pelikan are people and accusation will tend to put them into an antagonistic stance. At least in the eyes of the North American distributor, act of dog is considered something a warranty can cover if you ask in the right tone.

 

 

MBs and Pelikans are made out of Lucite?

 

 

Aye aye, Lucite is just another name for acrylic, the scheme being similar to MB's "precious" resin ...as I've mentioned earlier, different branding.

 

And on the subject again, seriously now, it's not that crazy/unusual to think that your pen might accidentally fall out of your pocket while you're walking...that would be your 1.2 meters (if you have long legs that is ). That being said, the pen should survive, maybe having a few scratches, but not a cleanly fractured section.

Edited September 19, 2014 by dragos.mocanu

[swafran]

@Ernst: no, I vented a little today on this forum, but in no way was I accusatory to Pelikan staff when I wrote to them. I am not at all someone who thinks he can abuse people just because they are at work (I know some are, but I am not). Here is the thread, I was polite, in spite of the fact that there were several long periods without answers from them.

 

 

Dear Mr Richardson,

The writing instruments are not designed for falling from a height of 1.20
to the floor. This falls into the category inappropriate use. We are sorry
to tell you that this case is excluded from the warranty. For your
information, pls see extract from the guarantee booklet hereto enclosed,
point 3.

Freundliche Gruesse / Best regards

Michaela Huesmann

Group Intercompany Order Management
Customer Service Export

fon: +49 (0) 511 6969-826
fax: +49 (0) 511 6969-279
e-mail: christiane.witt(at)pelikan.com

Pelikan Vertriebsgesellschaft mbH & Co. KG, Germany, 30163 Hannover,
Werftstraße 9
Domicile:Hannover
Register Court:District Court Hannover (HRA 24756)

Personally liable shareholder:Pelikan Vertrieb Verwaltungs GmbH
Domicile: Hannover
Register Court:District Court Hannover (HRB 51230)
Managing Directors:Torsten Jahn


-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: François Richardson [mailto:theswa@gmail.com]
Gesendet: Dienstag, 16. September 2014 15:11
An: Christiane Witt
Betreff: Re: AW: WG: Pelikan Exclusive - Contact Request (en_US) CUSTOMER is
IN FRANCE

Thank you for you reply =)

Here are the photos. Please let me know.

Thanks

François Richardson



Le 16/09/14 14:20, Christiane Witt a écrit :
> Dear Mr Richardson,
>
> My colleague Ms Witt is on vacation. We have not received the pictures.
> Kindly ask you to send them again.
>
> Thank you very much
>
> Freundliche Gruesse / Best regards
>
> Michaela Huesmann
>
> Group Intercompany Order Management
> Customer Service Export
>
> fon: +49 (0) 511 6969-826
> fax: +49 (0) 511 6969-279
> e-mail: christiane.witt(at)pelikan.com
>
> Pelikan Vertriebsgesellschaft mbH & Co. KG, Germany, 30163 Hannover,
> Werftstraße 9 Domicile:Hannover Register Court:District Court Hannover
> (HRA 24756)
>
> Personally liable shareholder:Pelikan Vertrieb Verwaltungs GmbH
> Domicile: Hannover
> Register Court:District Court Hannover (HRB 51230) Managing
> Directors:Torsten Jahn
>
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: François Richardson [mailto:theswa@gmail.com]
> Gesendet: Dienstag, 16. September 2014 11:22
> An: Christiane Witt
> Betreff: Re: WG: Pelikan Exclusive - Contact Request (en_US) CUSTOMER
> is IN FRANCE
>
> Hello
>
> Did you get the photos? I sent them in an attached zip on 28/8, it's
> been a while, so I wanted to check that you received them. I can send
> them again if you need me to.
>
> The pen fell from a height of only 1.20m onto linoleum floor and broke
> in half. I think this indicates a defect and would like a replacement
> under the warranty.
>
> Thank you very much,
>
> François Richardson

>
>
> Le 27/08/14 15:23, Christiane Witt a écrit :
>> Dear Mr. Richardson,
>>
>> Kindly send us a photo so to check for repair ,
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> Freundliche Gruesse / Best regards
>>
>> Christiane Witt
>>
>> Group Intercompany Order Management
>> Customer Service Export
>>
>> fon: +49 (0) 511 6969-826
>> fax: +49 (0) 511 6969-279
>> e-mail: christiane.witt(at)pelikan.com
>>
>> Pelikan Vertriebsgesellschaft mbH & Co. KG, Germany, 30163 Hannover,
>> Werftstraße 9 Domicile:Hannover Register Court:District Court
>> Hannover (HRA 24756)
>>
>> Personally liable shareholder:Pelikan Vertrieb Verwaltungs GmbH
>> Domicile: Hannover
>> Register Court:District Court Hannover (HRB 51230) Managing
>> Directors:Torsten Jahn
>>
>>
>> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>> Von: Pen Repair [mailto:penrepair@chartpak.com]
>> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 27. August 2014 15:18
>> An: 'Huesmann, Michaela'
>> Cc: 'Christiane Witt'; 'Nancy Kopec'
>> Betreff: FW: Pelikan Exclusive - Contact Request (en_US) CUSTOMER is
>> IN FRANCE
>>
>> Good Morning,
>>
>> Please assist with this customer inquiry from FRANCE. Thank you
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Abi

Edited September 19, 2014 by swafran

[DrCodfish]

You see this as the result of a 'bad pen'. Another may see it as the result of a 'careless user'. What height of drop do you think a pen should be able to withstand? I agree that saying that dropping a pen on the floor is not the 'intrended use' sounds silly, but I also feel that saying that because the pen broke when you dropped it shows that it is a 'bad open' is also silly, I mean, it is a fountain pen, not a door stop.

 

I have several M600's, they are my favorite Pelikan form, and they are fabulous writers for me. If one of them broke, I would either fix or replace it. Becase they are so valuable (and expensive) to me, I make efforts to assure that I don't drop them on the floor, but accidents happen, and when they do I ask first "was I to blame?" and if so I react accordingly.

[swafran]

I guess I was just hoping a quality pen would not break cleanly in half on impact from such a reasonable fall. I would make the case that writing instruments and other office supplies are occasionally dropped. I bet we all have dropped one before, and I bet none of us think of ourselves as careless, or use pens as doorstops.

 

Imho, pens should be manufactured to withstand one occasional such drop, and generally are--every other office supply in my office, including my Parker fountain pen, my bic ball point pens and various electronic gizmos can withstand such a reasonable fall. Except the one I saved up for so long, hoping for a good workhorse. I thought my money was going to quality, and I was disappointed.

 

I'll get over it, it's not the end of the world. But I'll probably get it over with one of dragos' suggestions, not with another M600.

[NedC]

If you want pens that are designed to survive falls from desks and the like you need to look to cheaper pens, brass bodied Chinese pens or cheaper student pens made from ABS or polypropylene, materials that are tougher and more impact resistant but also more likely to show scuffing and scratching. Less luxurious, nib quality, not gold at those price points and the quality with regards to smoothness, alignment and flow is likely to be much more hit and miss.

[FayeV]

 

Try this for size: https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/index.php/topic/92073-the-lamy-2000-experiment/ And Lamy does update their design if it proves to be faulty (see the major 2009 change).

 

 

Thanks for the link to this post. I hadn't seen it before. I'm really surprised anyone would do such tests on a Lamy 2000.

My daughter dropped my Lamy Vista, made of ABS, from around 1m high and it survived OK.

I haven't (yet) accidentally dropped any of my Pelikans to see what would happen.

Part of the reason why I like posting my pens is that they have less tendency to roll when I set it down. Of course there is still a chance of it flying off the table when I'm quickly shuffling papers on my desk.

[prf5]

This is a most unfortunate accident that can happen to anyone. I suspect that the surface, the force, and the angle contributed to the break. While the company may be able to sustain its position and you don't appear to have a basis for claiming that that the product is defective, the type and extent of the damage are probably a matter of bad luck. In other words, it's likely that in a similar instance, there would have been very minor damage or no damage at all. If the nib and cap are in tact, you can cannabilize the pen. I have had to send my m400 out for custom grinding; if you can put your current nib in a different body, in one respect you may be ahead of the game.

[swafran]

Thanks for all the opinions, they are interesting.

 

Yeah, I was unlucky. Angle = unknown, force = that of gravity from a low height, surface = linoleum. I would expect a reasonably sturdy instrument to withstand that at any angle though.

 

My pen did fall capped. The pen broke right above the screw, leaving the screw and nib stuck in the cap.

 

I appreciate this is a Pelikan forum, so band loyalty is probably high, but I'm not biased towards any one company so looking at this pretty objectively, I see only 2 possibilities:

• either Souveräns are meant to be showcase pens only, and are not spec'd to withstand real-world use by writers , or
• I had a defective one

As for customer service, I think maybe they are honest but just didn't believe me. But if that's the case, then that sucks anyways.

 

I'm off to find a pen, that oh, doesn't, well, break in half if it falls off your desk.

[brewsky]

Thanks for all the opinions, they are interesting.

 

Yeah, I was unlucky. Angle = unknown, force = that of gravity from a low height, surface = linoleum. I would expect a reasonably sturdy instrument to withstand that at any angle though.

 

My pen did fall capped. The pen broke right above the screw, leaving the screw and nib stuck in the cap.

 

I appreciate this is a Pelikan forum, so band loyalty is probably high, but I'm not biased towards any one company so looking at this pretty objectively, I see only 2 possibilities:

• either Souveräns are meant to be showcase pens only, and are not spec'd to withstand real-world use by writers , or
• I had a defective one

As for customer service, I think maybe they are honest but just didn't believe me. But if that's the case, then that sucks anyways.

 

I'm off to find a pen, that oh, doesn't, well, break in half if it falls off your desk.

 

The point you are making is an ignorant one. I have read your entire post and can only sit here shaking my head. Let me give you a similar analogy to what you are requiring of pelikan "dear Toyota, I drove my sedan off of a loading dock. The fall from this caused me to bend my frame. This is a defective automobile." I truly hope you are just trolling, because you HAVE to know you are neither being fair nor making any sense. You don't get a warrantee from a user caused circumstance.

[ac12]

What is under the linoleum is cement/concrete.

In my experience, linoleum has very little/almost no give/cushioning. And it is only about 2 mm thick.

 

Sorry but were it any other pen, the answer would be the same...It is not a manufacturing defect and not subject to a warranty claim.

Were you to drop a Nikon or Cannon camera 1.2m onto a concrete floor and broke the lens in half, the damage is due to your dropping the camera. Warranty claim denied.

 

If you were looking for sympathy, sorry, not in this case.

Yes I'm sorry you lost your pen, but not that you could not make a claim against the manufacturer.

Edited September 20, 2014 by ac12

[prf5]

I regret what happened to your pen, and I can't endorse the behavior of the company or some of the comments here. They don't seem to understand that brand loyalty isn't stipulated, it is earned. Given the competition especially from Chinese pens, I suspect that in 10 years Pelikan will be doing everything they can to win back its customer base. I bought a Souveran m400 mainly because of its balance and weight. Along with that comes a risk, as well as one difficulty after another to get the nib right. It is currently reposing in a nibmeister's queue and it will be there for five or six months. Frankly, I don't miss the pen, although it has shown enough potential to warrant my effort. But my patience isn't endless. Fortunately for you, there are lots of choices, including metal, ebonite, and wood finishes. I'd have a good look at the Faber-Castell line, especially the Basic. Some people favor the Lamy 2000. It's not my taste, but worth considering.

[Matlock]

Once again we seem to be getting into the "knock Pelikan" (or Conway Stewart or MB or any other brand that we need to have a go at today). If you drop a pen, or camera as ac12 points out, you have dropped it. If it survives great, if not it is your fault end of story. A carefully worded letter to Pelikan could have yielded results but to accuse them of selling you a bad pen is nonsence. My wife had an accident in her car and ended up in a pond but she didn't accuse Vauxhall of selling her a bad car. I think it is time to put this one to bed!

[prf5]

My wife had an accident in her car and ended up in a pond but she didn't accuse Vauxhall of selling her a bad car.

 

I thought that only occurred in television commercials!