Realo Versus Cartridge-Converter Sailor

[Bruno Taut]

Often times stylophiles complain about the lack of exciting filling systems on some brands and how self-filling systems hold more ink than cartridges and converters.

 

Well... The following table summarizes the situation for Sailor pens, focusing on the Profit (1911) model. The situation for the Professional Gear model is basically the same, with the exception of having a smaller selection on nibs. At least, according to the Japanese catalog of the brand.

 

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-GqKOXxmwU14/Tt1bq0bSzfI/AAAAAAAACoQ/DLsQZrkSxOU/s1600/Table%2BSailor%2BRealo%2Band%2Bconverters-WM.jpg

 

Is it worth to pay JPY 10500 more for a piston that holds less ink than the Sailor cartridge?

 

More in-depth analysis, on this chronicle.

 

Cheers,

 

Iosepus

[geoduc]

I have a 1911 Realo and while I appreciate the piston fill system and the ink window, I would probably just buy the c/c version if I had it to do over again.

 

The pen isn't going to write any better with one fill system over the other, the extra ink capacity over the converter is minimal, and I'm not fond of the extra two gold rings that flank the ink window on the Realo. I think they detract from the overall look of the pen.

[Namo]

I for one think that piston filler are a bit overrated; but in the same time, I think that converter don't hold enough ink - and there, the numbers you mention are very interesting. Therefore, I like two options: first, ED with a shutting valve; second, a ED pen with the possibiliy of using it with converter or cartridges. I also like a lot vacuum filler, like in the Parker Vacumatic, but I am afraid it is a bit fragile and difficult to fix. Nothing "romantic" there: I do write a lot outide my home of office, and like having a big ink capacity - and cartridges are expensive.

[drgoretex]

Personally, I love the piston fill. I love the ink window and the two extra gold rings on the barrel. I love being able to see the colour of the ink I use, and I love the process of drawing ink up with the piston.

 

Ya - for me, the extra $ for the piston is very much worth it, and I will be buying another Realo!

 

Cheers,

 

Ken

[KostasK]

Remember what wise men say:

"Chase the nib, not the pen".

Kostas

[jde]

Is it worth to pay JPY 10500 more for a piston that holds less ink than the Sailor cartridge?

 

 

 

 

If I were a cart user, my answer to your question would be "no."

 

But I'm not a cart user. I use either the converter or other mechanism to fill the barrel. So, 1ml is better for moi than 0.7 That's why I chose a Pro Gear Realo over a non-piston filling Pro Gear. I certainly wish it held more like 1.5ml but the 1ml works. (It was surprising to me when I found a lot of piston filling pens I had only held 1ml or 1.2ml...and that's why I moved to eyedroppers.) Honestly, though, I don't like that I paid so much for it.

 

FYI: In the US, buying from Nibs.com there are a few more nib choices to be had.

 

I appreciate that you post information in the way you do!

 

Cheers.

 

 

[tinta]

"losepus", I'm just curious where your chart was taken from.

 

The manufacturer's?

A distributor or store ( the prices are quoted in Yen)?

On a USA seller's useful chart, the Sailor standard converters are 0.9 ml. capacity, the Realos are 1.5 ml.

Are these just optimistic figures?

 

All my pens use Sailor standard converters. There isn't a lot of mileage possible with these converters, but I thought the Realos held much more ink than the stated 1.0 ml.

Were it not for the 1911 Realo's thicker grip-section, I would have opted for a Burgundy version.

 

A full converter usually lasts me for at least one letter, of three double-sided 5A sheets (either Rhodia vellum or OCM cotton). My pens are set up for a more or less medium flow, for 0.8 mm to 1.1 mm, bladed-nibs.

 

With the amount of hand writing I do, these converters are more than adequate.

 

Cheers:

 

Istvan

Edited December 10, 2011 by tinta

[Rekord]

Interesting chart.

 

From www.nibs. com, the site of nibmeister John Mottishaw

Ink capacity Realo:

"This is one of the most popular of the Sailor brand pens, and one reason is its ink capacity, a generous 1.5 ml."

From my experience filling my Realo I would say it is more than 1 ml although I never measured how much more it is. May be I should do that now I am curious

 

In my case the choice is clear. I almost never use cartridges, always ink from bottles, considering the choices of colors and brands. Convertors to me always have looked kind of flimsy and the pistons have an interesting mechanism, more capacity. But yes the piston fillers are more expensive.

[jde]

From www.nibs. com, the site of nibmeister John Mottishaw

Ink capacity Realo:

 

 

I'm not sure this is up to date information.

 

I have a current model ProGear Realo bought only a few weeks ago from Nibs.com. The capacity is indeed 1ml. (I measured by taking ink from a sample bottle with ml marks.) From the included papers, Sailor lists the capacity as 1cc. Scan of that is below.

 

And here Tazio aka engeika of eBay, lists a "Sailor Profit" as having 1cc. I would presume this to be current too. (1cc is equal to 1ml)

 

I do remember that there was a Realo that held 1.5 but do not know which model that was/is. Or if it is available as a King of Pen or some such. Dunno.

The 95th Anniversary Realo refers to 1.5ml in an FPN review.

Edited December 10, 2011 by jde

[Bruno Taut]

Thanks, jde, for your prompt reply to tinta's question.

 

I also measured the capacities of Realo's piston, and Sailor standard cartridges and converters. I always followed the same procedure: filling them with water and weighting them empty and full. I repeated the measurements between 5 and 10 times.

 

A Sailor's staff in Tokyo told me --as jde points out-- that the Realo's capacity was 1 ml. I could not believe my ears and proceeded to measure it as soon as I put my hands on a Realo. Well, she was right. Sadly right.

 

Again, as jde said, the first Realo, the 95th anniversary limited edition, was based on the King of Pen model and its piston capacity must be significantly larger:

 

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_aQ69G8Wh9To/TIE_UfmV2sI/AAAAAAAAArA/4O8QbPERvNM/s1600/IMG_2370-blog.jpg

 

However, I have not measured the ink capacity of this King of Pen Realo.

 

Cheers,

 

Iosepus

[tinta]

Thanks "losepus" & "jde" for the really interesting links to Sailor products. The site (blog?) that appears to be from Spain has quite extensive information. I'll spend some time visiting there.

Cheers:

Istvan

[Rekord]

From www.nibs. com, the site of nibmeister John Mottishaw

Ink capacity Realo:

 

 

I'm not sure this is up to date information.

 

I do remember that there was a Realo that held 1.5 but do not know which model that was/is. Or if it is available as a King of Pen or some such. Dunno.

The 95th Anniversary Realo refers to 1.5ml in an FPN review.

 

Thanks! Good points. My pen is not the anniversary Realo (I wish), it looks like the one on engeika (only color is different). I will try to measure it with a pipette from a med lab (if I can find one) but it looks like it is 1ml and not 1.5ml.

And now that you mentioned is King of Pen using the same convertors or have special (meaning higher capacity) convertors?

 

I think part of the problem is that some of the pens are Japanese market only, with specs only in Japanese, and sometime the information gets "lost in translation"

[jde]

 

And now that you mentioned is King of Pen using the same convertors or have special (meaning higher capacity) convertors?

 

 

 

Re. the converters they are the same. there is no high capacity Sailor converter.

[Joe in Seattle]

Sailor c/c systems work very very well in my experience. Given nib quality and good ink delivery a piston is only icing on the cake.

[nicholasyeo]

Piston fillers are definitely overrrated. I don't like to see ink stains on my nib

and using a converter I can get it really clean because I suck up ink or use a

syringe to get it real nice and clean. Better still, the pen can be primed rather

than shaken to get it flowing as compared to cartridges! Nevertheless, pistons

are associated with larger ink capacity aren't they? :hmm1: Eyedropper would

be nice too, if I got one of those it'd be lovely...

Edited December 11, 2011 by nicholasyeo

[ashokdad]

Piston fillers are definitely overrrated. I don't like to see ink stains on my nib

and using a converter I can get it really clean because I suck up ink or use a

syringe to get it real nice and clean. Better still, the pen can be primed rather

than shaken to get it flowing as compared to cartridges! Nevertheless, pistons

are associated with larger ink capacity aren't they? Eyedropper would

be nice too, if I got one of those it'd be lovely...

Can the nib and feed be removed on both pens (Realo and Profit)? Stephen Brown has a FP shoot out between the 1911 and Montblanc 146(?) where he shows that the nib and feed are pressure fit. Can the nib and feed be easily pulled out of the piston filler for better cleaning?

[anton1978]

I filled sailor cartridges with a syringe many times

 

its capacity is 1 ml, like Sailor Realo

[leomitch]

Personally, I love the piston fill. I love the ink window and the two extra gold rings on the barrel. I love being able to see the colour of the ink I use, and I love the process of drawing ink up with the piston.

 

Ya - for me, the extra $ for the piston is very much worth it, and I will be buying another Realo! :thumbup:

 

Cheers,

 

Ken

I am with you mate! I love evrything about the Realo. The filling system works like a dream...it is so easy. Even if it doesn't hold as much ink as many other piston fillers, it works for me. Looks good, feels good in the hand, writes like silk, fills easily...what else could one ask for?

 

Leo

[mori45]

Although the piston tank is smaller than a cartridge, carrying/refilling carts is enough of an inconvenience that I'd be willing to overlook the .2 mL.

 

Also, one can't really claim fountain pen superiority to the disposable ballpoint while they're tossing cartridges left and right

[leomitch]

Although the piston tank is smaller than a cartridge, carrying/refilling carts is enough of an inconvenience that I'd be willing to overlook the .2 mL.

 

Also, one can't really claim fountain pen superiority to the disposable ballpoint while they're tossing cartridges left and right

LOL! Too true mate!

 

Cheers

Leo