Copperplate With A Fountain Pen

[caliken]

http://i1027.photobucket.com/albums/y331/fuchsiaprincess/Ken.jpg

Thank you Soki, for your generous offer but I have to decline for the same reasoning as I expressed to Mauricio in response to his offer, earlier in this thread.

 

Much appreciated.

 

Nice flex writing, BTW.

 

Ken

[Florenze]

Steve Jobs and Calligraphy: the speech at Stanford (2005) is being used now as a tribute to Steve in his own words. Many people who didn't know about his connection to the calligraphy program started by Lloyd Reynolds at Reed, were surprised to hear about this influence. It's fun to watch video of Lloyd Reynolds' work (from 40 years ago) on YouTube, and then to see Ken Fraser posting on FPN and YouTube (along with other master calligraphers). Great to realize that when we all pick up our pens and practice letterforms, we're keeping an art-form alive that came close to being lost. Even when our descenders and hairlines aren't perfect.

 

 

Edited October 7, 2011 by Florenze

[Bronze]

Ken, was the "Upright flex nib script" from your website written with a fountain pen? I would love to see some more of it, and maybe even the full alphabet (majuscule and miniscule) if you have it written out.

 

I am just starting out with flexible nibs and am looking for a script to use as a base for a daily handwriting style using a flexible nib funtain pen. Trying to write in copperplate or spencerian with a fountain pen seems too difficult to be practical (for me at least), and the dramatic slope is part of the appeal of those scripts.

 

 

(The "Upright flex nib script" reminds me of a handwriting example by Katim posted a while ago if I remember correctly.)

 

 

By the way, I am enjoying your Italic Variants book

[ihtzazqamar]

[caliken]

Ken, was the "Upright flex nib script" from your website written with a fountain pen? I would love to see some more of it, and maybe even the full alphabet (majuscule and miniscule) if you have it written out.

Bronze,

 

This must be the example you're referring to.

 

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd289/caliken_2007/foralongtime600.jpg

 

I don't have the full alphabet written out, but it's just a variation on italic but written upright, with a flexible nib. I think that I used a dip nib for this, but as there is no slope to contend with, it could just as easily have been written out with a fountain pen.

 

I'm glad that you're enjoying the Italic Variants book.

 

Ken

[Bronze]

Ken, was the "Upright flex nib script" from your website written with a fountain pen? I would love to see some more of it, and maybe even the full alphabet (majuscule and miniscule) if you have it written out.

Bronze,

 

This must be the example you're referring to.

 

 

 

I don't have the full alphabet written out, but it's just a variation on italic but written upright, with a flexible nib. I think that I used a dip nib for this, but as there is no slope to contend with, it could just as easily have been written out with a fountain pen.

 

I'm glad that you're enjoying the Italic Variants book.

 

Ken

 

 

Thanks Ken, yes, that was the example I was referring to. I I have some practicing to do now.

It appears you were using two different versions of the miniscule ' r '.

Since I am already working on my italic this type of script looks like a good way to get into some flex writing, without using the oblique pen holder.

[Chevalier]

I couldn't find a UK or European supplier for the metal-flanged, oblique holder. Where would you get the separate flange?

 

Sorry, I think I relied too much on the notification system.

 

Soennecken and others produced a "Federsteller" or "Ellenbogenhalter", it's not easy to get them now. Andreas Schenk had them some time ago, but they have been sold at a quite high price with an included wooden holder. The other option is the "Ellenbogenfeder" or "Elbownib", they are easier to get, Baionette EF, Mitchell Copper Plate and others.

Edited October 21, 2011 by Chevalier

[WestLothian]

I couldn't find a UK or European supplier for the metal-flanged, oblique holder. Where would you get the separate flange?

 

Sorry, I think I relied too much on the notification system.

 

Soennecken and others produced a "Federsteller" or "Ellenbogenhalter", it's not easy to get them now. Andreas Schenk had them some time ago, but they have been sold at a quite high price with an included wooden holder. The other option is the "Ellenbogenfeder" or "Elbownib", they are easier to get, Baionette EF, Mitchell Copper Plate and others.

 

Thank you. I eventually ordered a brass flanged holder from John Neal. When you see how basic the part is you easily could snip one out of brass sheet.

For comparison, I also ordered the Mitchell offset nib to try.

[Chevalier]

I have many holders at home and needed to replace the brass flange multiple times already (but I use them a lot with different nibs). It's easy to ruin them if you need to adjust them multiple times. However, those holders with fixed brass flange are the best, the flange placed in a standard holder and elbow nibs are inferior, because it's impossible to adjust the angle of the holder.

 

I wish there was an easier way to replace the flanges though. I don't want to buy a new holder every time I need a new flange. I usually snip mine out of a brass sheet and deburr them with my Proxxon tool (like a Dremel), but I wouldn't mind investing a couple of cents more to be able to get them ready made.

[Mickey]

The Blackwell holder (available from John Neal) does not require potentially metal fatiguing adjustment to accept different sized nibs. It has a set screw. You can't really adjust the rake angle (angle of attack) on it, but its default angle is pretty close to optimum. (This is my present favorite holder) The Pen and Ink Arts adjustable holders also accepts a range of nibs with minimum adjustment. Again this holder is difficult (but not impossible) to adjust for rake angle, but, like the Blackwell, the default angle (specified by Joe Vitolo) is pretty close to spot on. (This is my second favorite.)

Edited October 23, 2011 by Mickey

[Chevalier]

The angle of the Blackwell Holder is almost perfect for my hand. I like it a lot, but other holders fit better into my hand, either really slim holders like the Zanerian Oblique or thick like the Thick Century.

 

I used to like the Peerless/Ziller Oblique Holders too, but I had no luck with them. I already broke two of them and one reached me already broken, even the cheap oblique plastic holders are tougher.

 

I thought about ordering new holders because the flanges have worn out, but that doesn't make a lot of sense. Is here someone who could suggest the right alloy for such flanges? It should be soft enough to be easily shaped but hard enough to stay in shape while flexing the nib.

[Mauricio]

Here's another wonderful vintage fountain pen nib fitted into a Waterman 12 eyedropper in hard rubber. The nib is a 14K Waterman Ideal New York #2 wet noodle that is capable of writing a XXXF-BBBB line. Yes, it can produce some the thinnest hairlines to massive 3.5mm wide swells. Wonderful snap-back. It took me many hours setting this nib up into this pen to get the ideal ink flow for all different flexy writing demands: Different line variations, different writing speeds, different ink demands, different writing directions, etc. This pen and nib are so nicely set up you can write for long periods of time ... and it will not skip or miss a bit. Very extreme results for a fountain pen with its ink reservoir and full portability advantages over dip pens/nibs. Enjoy it ...

 

The pen

 

The nib

 

Some writing samples. Paper is Rhodia Block 13 with 5x5mm squares

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now, I can just imagine the results of this pen/nib in the hands of someone how has a very light and steady hand.

[smk]

Mauricio - its examples like these that make me ink up my humble Noodler's flex pen again, only to be frustrated and realize it'll take something this good to really enjoy flex in a fountain pen.

 

Thanks for showing us this nib - it is just superb.

 

Salman

[subbes]

Finally, something I, as a lefthander, have an advantage in!

 

Here is a badly-photographed example of (extremely irregular, in no way Copperplate) script on a 55-degree slant, written with the new Noodler's Flex and using a 3:1 dilution of Noodler's Zhivago.

 

 

 

You can see there's not a lot of variation in the line widths. Additionally I have to exert more force than I'd like in order to get full flex, and for a couple of days I had to tweak the feed and nib five or six times in order to get it to a good flow. However, it was only $14.

 

(Obviously, I am a complete beginner.)

[Mickey]

The angle of the Blackwell Holder is almost perfect for my hand. I like it a lot, but other holders fit better into my hand, either really slim holders like the Zanerian Oblique or thick like the Thick Century.

 

 

There are two versions of the Blackwell holder. One is wooden with a cylindrical grip (it's the more expensive model). The other is plastic and has an hour-glass shaped gripping area more like the Zanerian or Century holders. I have one of each. The wooden shafted version is my standard holder; my wife prefers the hour-glass shape. (I have another, less well known holder on order and will report after I give it a test drive.)

 

BTW, you can always build up the gripping area with a little cloth or sponge tape. I think the slight give of the sponge tape also encourages a soft, but secure grip. Following on that thought and getting back on topic, it's too bad the Omas Emotica doesn't cover the section with the same material as the body. With the nib reground to XF or XXF, it would likely be an excellent FP for Copperplate.

[Chevalier]

Oh, I haven't seen the hourglass Blackwell Holder yet, is it the holder from the set? I have the Blackwell Holder that made me call it "Nib on a Stick".

 

I'd love to make my own pen holders, too bad that we have to sleep, I could really use those extra hours.

Edited October 29, 2011 by Chevalier

[Mickey]

Oh, I haven't seen the hourglass Blackwell Holder yet, is it the holder from the set? I have the Blackwell Holder that made me call it "Nib on a Stick".

 

I'd love to make my own pen holders, too bad that we have to sleep, I could really use those extra hours.

 

John Neal Bookseller has both models. The "Nib on a Stick" is $38.00 (my preference.) The plastic model, built on a shaft similar to the regular Speedball holder, is $27.50 (my wife's preference). Other than providing different grip feels and very slightly different balances, they are functionally identical and work very well.

[Chevalier]

Is it the same flange? I think I could cut a part of the mount away and place it in a deepened? slit of a Speedball holder.

 

I think I'd prefer to mount the flange on another holder in that case, about $25 for another flange (those Hunt and Speedball holders are really cheap and I still have a couple of dozens unused) seems a little too much to me. I hardly use my nib on a stick because I don't like the wooden part enough to use it. It's still nice and all, but I have other holders I always pick up before I come to the Blackwell holder.

[Mauricio]

Mauricio - its examples like these that make me ink up my humble Noodler's flex pen again, only to be frustrated and realize it'll take something this good to really enjoy flex in a fountain pen.

 

Thanks for showing us this nib - it is just superb.

 

Salman

 

Salman,

 

Thanks for your kind words. Glad to hear you like it. I just pulled a Conklin Crescent into its regular rotation and this Conklin pen/nib display very similar writing characteristics to the Waterman 12 pen/nib mentioned in my previous post.. It is a lot of fun writing with these pens. My goal is to invest some time next year to focus on very light writing so I can better control those ultra thin and ultra flex nibs. That is when I will join your group learning (actually, mastering already) Copperplate writing. All the best to you Salman.

[gibsona9]

A few years ago, I went to a yard sale, and bought a lot of calligraphy books/supplies that was wrapped up in plastic. Somehow, I put it up in storage and never opened it!

 

Now that I am getting back into calligraphy a bit, I discovered it the other day and opened it. Found some cool dip nibs (Brause, Speedball "steel brushes", etc) and also two Osmiroid fountain pens, with a large assortment of nibs.

 

One in particular that caught my eye was the Osmiroid Copperplate nib. Although it would not be considered "full flex", it has a wonderfully thin hairline, thinner than my Nishiki Falcon. It is the closest to a dip pen nib that I have ever seen in a fountain pen, mainly due to its ability to write a nice thin hairline.

 

In any case, here's a look at it (sorry for the blob on the "a" in "fountain", I picked up a piece of lint!). Does anyone else have any experience with this wonderful pen/nib combo?